Retractable seating at the OS

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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by paulhs1 »

The Rebirth wrote:
How many more times!! this part is down to US.

You could say that BG has no atmosphere regularly... in fact other fans have said it to me.

Why is this always used as a point against moving to the OS is beyond me.

1 maybe 2 games a year you get a wall of noise at the BG.

Disaster for the club? Please explain how this could be a disaster for our club and what you think could realistically happen to us because of this move.
All you have to do is look at all the clubs throughout the world that have moved into an athletics stadium and then had to move out due to lack of atmosphere and lower attendances, only problem is that we are signing up to a lease of over 100 years, meaning if in 10 years we want to move we may be obliged to stay!
This is a big risk for our club a massive risk!
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by Hammer110 »

paulhs1 wrote:
Hammer110... You have just answered your own question in the same sentence, we are moving to an athletics stadium with potentially no atmosphere is that not justification enough to think it will be a disaster for the club?
No you miss my point the club will have based their business plan on xx numbers of bums on seats, 50,000 fans in the O/S who generate no atmosphere is not a disaster for the club as long as they keep coming, I wouldn't like it and you wouldn't but the accountants would as happy as pigs in ****.
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by paulhs1 »

Hammer110 wrote:
No you miss my point the club will have based their business plan on xx numbers of bums on seats, 50,000 fans in the O/S who generate no atmosphere is not a disaster for the club as long as they keep coming, I wouldn't like it and you wouldn't but the accountants would as happy as pigs in sh*t.
It's crazy that as football fans we are accepting this for our club! History has proven with nearly all the clubs in athletics stadiums that attencances drop and they lose atmosphere, so why would we buck the trend and actually get more fans to come along, kids for a quid for the majority of the season won't bring in revenue in the long term?
It's all on a wing and a prayer with some basing their arguement on the back of a big leap of faith being taken that our owers will do the right thing.
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by The Rebirth »

paulhs1 wrote:
All you have to do is look at all the clubs throughout the world that have moved into an athletics stadium and then had to move out due to lack of atmosphere and lower attendances, only problem is that we are signing up to a lease of over 100 years, meaning if in 10 years we want to move we may be obliged to stay!
This is a big risk for our club a massive risk!
Here's an idea.

West Ham move in 10 years time we're paying 95% of the Upkeep costs Athletics and the other sports cannot match us. Owners get disgruntled that we're effectively paying for Uk Athletics to keep a home. Owners realise that it doesn't work for football (maybe) in its new format.

We then look at the original plans for a 25k Stadium and enquire about the land where the Warm up tracks are.

We build a new stadium on the site of the old warm up track and still maintain the dismantled OS with the council for concerts/rugby/sports days and community work.

We could even use the OS as a training ground for instance or for reserve fixtures!

We would still be keeping to our original terms that the running track stays the UK Athletics still keep their home?

It's just an idea it probably wouldn't happen but still I like to try and think outside the box
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by The Rebirth »

paulhs1 wrote: It's crazy that as football fans we are accepting this for our club! History has proven with nearly all the clubs in athletics stadiums that attencances drop and they lose atmosphere, so why would we buck the trend and actually get more fans to come along, kids for a quid for the majority of the season won't bring in revenue in the long term?
It's all on a wing and a prayer with some basing their arguement on the back of a big leap of faith being taken that our owers will do the right thing.
Again how can we lose something we do not even have most of the time?

the BG is ****ing dull if you sit anywhere other than the Chicken run closest to the Aways the STBL/Chav Corner or patches of the BML.

Rest of the ground is dog for atmosphere every game

Also you pull me up or the pro movers for having a leap of faith trusting they'll do the right thing but you're doing EXACTLY the opposite dismissing it before it even happens or they get a chance to prove you wrong.

Also have you even sat in an OS and watched a DECENT game of football?
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by paulhs1 »

The Rebirth wrote:
Here's an idea.

West Ham move in 10 years time we're paying 95% of the Upkeep costs Athletics and the other sports cannot match us. Owners get disgruntled that we're effectively paying for Uk Athletics to keep a home. Owners realise that it doesn't work for football (maybe) in its new format.

We then look at the original plans for a 25k Stadium and enquire about the land where the Warm up tracks are.

We build a new stadium on the site of the old warm up track and still maintain the dismantled OS with the council for concerts/rugby/sports days and community work.

We could even use the OS as a training ground for instance or for reserve fixtures!

We would still be keeping to our original terms that the running track stays the UK Athletics still keep their home?

It's just an idea it probably wouldn't happen but still I like to try and think outside the box
Is this what you want/hope to happen?
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by paulhs1 »

Double post
Last edited by paulhs1 on Sun Oct 09, 2011 7:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by paulhs1 »

The Rebirth wrote: Again how can we lose something we do not even have most of the time?

the BG is f***ing dull if you sit anywhere other than the Chicken run closest to the Aways the STBL/Chav Corner or patches of the BML.

Rest of the ground is dog for atmosphere every game
I must admit the atmosphere this season has not been great but if you think there is no atmosphere now then what will it be like when you are further away from the pitch and can't here anything from the other end of the stadium.
Only when we move to the OS will we fully appreciate the lack of view, noise, atmosphere and the feeling of being at a football match.
The Rebirth wrote: Also you pull me up or the pro movers for having a leap of faith trusting they'll do the right thing but you're doing EXACTLY the opposite dismissing it before it even happens or they get a chance to prove you wrong.
I agree, im doing the complete opposite and not taking a leap of faith. Instead im looking at the evidence from all the other football clubs that have moved away from athletics stadiums, all the experts which say it won't work and my own gut feeling as a football fan which tells me that it's wrong for the club.
The Rebirth wrote: Also have you even sat in an OS and watched a DECENT game of football?
No and I don't have to watch a game at an OS stadium to realise that the move will be a disaster!
And if you don't think it will be a disaster then why did you suggest in your previous post that there may be a possibility that we could move out in 10 years?
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by The Rebirth »

Atmosphere has been terrible bar a handful games that I've been to since my first ever West Ham game in 2005. (late starter I grew up outside of London and had nobody to take me to games until I moved here) I was told that the BG was one of the best grounds in the country I was lets put it mildly massively disappointed when I saw what the Rio Stand was all about. I am currently loving it in the STBL but sit halfway around the stadium you won't even hear us! Someone posted on here that is due to the roof being so close so the sound doesn't travel very far due to that.

I expect in a more open stadium with a proper roof that holds in the acoustics to be much better... (not saying we'll get that but another hope)

You're not looking at the evidence at all don't come out with that... Roma get a decent atmosphere? so do Berlin? What evidence and where have you gathered it? All you've done is see that continental teams have moved out and although some have made passing comments about it the real reason for Juventus's move was so they actually OWNED the ground.

So you're writing off something you effectively have no experience of... I don't think I need to make anymore comments on that mate!

With regards to what I want to happen ... I try to think outside the box and after glancing at the Olympic site that idea popped into my head. It's an idea it's an option it could happen it probably won't. I can live with it either way.
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by Hammer110 »

paulhs1 wrote:It's crazy that as football fans we are accepting this for our club!
The problem is the moment the club announced we would be bidding for the O/S the fans the should have their feelings known if they didn't want to go. Instead the protest amounted to IMHO a poorly supported anti O/S campaign & petition organised by Nigel, just 3-4,000 signed the petition against the O/S. The lack of any mass protests told the Daves all they need to know, that the majority of fans will go the with the flow!
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by The Rebirth »

Hammer110 wrote:
The problem is the moment the club announced we would be bidding for the O/S the fans the should have their feelings known if they didn't want to go. Instead the protest amounted to IMHO a poorly supported anti O/S campaign & petition organised by Nigel, just 3-4,000 signed the petition against the O/S. The lack of any mass protests told the Daves all they need to know, that the majority of fans will go the with the flow!
Good effort by Nigel but the owners could point out where were the other 25,000 West Ham fans that attended the match that day? Could they argue that 20,000 of those or more were up for the move?
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by Hammer110 »

When we discussed clubs that had done away with tracks on the original O/S thread, many of them had other primary reasons for the move/rebuild other than the track itself. Reasons included stadiums didn't meet World Cup criteria, too costly to maintain and architect's family wouldn't allow the stadium to be altered to fully enclose it.
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by Sweeney Bod »

Hammer110 wrote:When we discussed clubs that had done away with tracks on the original O/S thread, many of them had other primary reasons for the move/rebuild other than the track itself. Reasons included stadiums didn't meet World Cup criteria, too costly to maintain and architect's family wouldn't allow the stadium to be altered to fully enclose it.
Whether it was discussed or not on any thread, that is complete tosh.

World Cup - Every World Cup, including recent have had stadiums some stadiums with tracks.

Too Costly - Yes because there was no need for the running track

The Architect Family - Yes that is the Olympic Stadium in Munich. However, Bayern and/or TSV did not insist on a track in their new stadium.

If you can find ANY fan that would choose a tracked stadium over a rectangular one, (unless there is no choice, or are deluded into believing moving to one will make them a Champion's League team), then I will eat my words.
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

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Few things:

The type of fan that G&S want to attract will ensure there is no atmosphere at the OS, the fact that fans will be nowhere near the roof in certain sections and that there will be a vast space between the pitch will mean that any noise will dissapate.

Also you say Roma / Berlin have great atmospheres, totally different stadiums structurally, and total different fan mentality compared to this country. G&S want to sanitise this further.

Also the rest of the ground can hear the TBL sing it's the away fans that can't hear us, and there have been plenty of decent atmospheres since 2005 by this countries standards.

Move to the OS and our hardcore support will be spread out across the bowl mixed in with the day-trippers that will not improve the atmosphere at all.
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

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NorthBankAlliance wrote:Few things:

The type of fan that G&S want to attract will ensure there is no atmosphere at the OS, the fact that fans will be nowhere near the roof in certain sections and that there will be a vast space between the pitch will mean that any noise will dissapate.

Also you say Roma / Berlin have great atmospheres, totally different stadiums structurally, and total different fan mentality compared to this country. G&S want to sanitise this further.

Also the rest of the ground can hear the TBL sing it's the away fans that can't hear us, and there have been plenty of decent atmospheres since 2005 by this countries standards.

Move to the OS and our hardcore support will be spread out across the bowl mixed in with the day-trippers that will not improve the atmosphere at all.
Not being funny but we're all stating our opinions on what we think will or happen or what we like.

You on the other hand bold as brass are saying this is what WILL happen.

How do you know? Really please tell us all how you know exactly what our owners think and why on earth they would want to make the OS a souless bowl?

Infact I seem to remember DS and Brady talking about the kids and getting pensioners in. They actually said those things. What about your claims?

Our hardcore support mate are our away support the guys who go to every away who sing loud and proud and are heard even when massively outnumbered. Why would they be spread out? If a club like Roma can organise their 'hardcore' to make the atmosphere better then why can't we? funny how all the atmosphere in the BG is in the cheaper seats and seats in the upper bands are silent.

Oh and those day trippers will be boosting our clubs revenue so in regards of them being there is nothing but a good thing.
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by Ben »

well I sure am glad I read the last few pages of this retractable seating thread :lol:
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by NorthBankAlliance »

As I said structurally compared to other Olympic Stadiums, Stratford will not keep the noise in.

For all the pro's and con's of it the people that G&S want to attract i.e. corporates / day-trippers / giving tickets to local school children will not really add to the atmosphere.

You say if Roma can organise something we can, which is true but people just don't have that same mentality, as well as the fact that in Italy fans can pretty much do what they want regarding flares / flags and the like. That would never be possible here for the obvious 'health and safety' reasons.

Atmosphere at the BG comes from behind the goals in the cheap seats, where there are large numbers of people standing,  at the OS I'm not convinced that we will be allowed to even stand, who knows?

I'd rather not trade in what we've got at the BG and it's potential, just for the off-chance we might get bought by someone rich and do a 'Chelsea'.
At the end of the day for the fans this will be a shocking move.
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

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NorthBankAlliance wrote:As I said structurally compared to other Olympic Stadiums, Stratford will not keep the noise in.

For all the pro's and con's of it the people that G&S want to attract i.e. corporates / day-trippers / giving tickets to local school children will not really add to the atmosphere.

You say if Roma can organise something we can, which is true but people just don't have that same mentality, as well as the fact that in Italy fans can pretty much do what they want regarding flares / flags and the like. That would never be possible here for the obvious 'health and safety' reasons.

Atmosphere at the BG comes from behind the goals in the cheap seats, where there are large numbers of people standing,  at the OS I'm not convinced that we will be allowed to even stand, who knows?

I'd rather not trade in what we've got at the BG and it's potential, just for the off-chance we might get bought by someone rich and do a 'Chelsea'.
At the end of the day for the fans this will be a shocking move.
With the new roof why not? if done correctly?

Well if those people add nothing to the atmosphere then there is nothing lost is there? But there is a financial gain from them being there. As I said you keep going on about atmosphere the BG is dull except a few pockets if the corporates fill the boxes, then we will gain more money in the long run.

BG and it's potential? What potential? what potentially will happen is we'll become an even smaller club in London.

You're obviously blind to this.

It has nothing to do with being bought by a rich arab. The move enhances our club globally and potential financial gains nobody here wants to become the new Chelsea.

Your arguments are fundamentally flawed and you're clinging to this atmosphere tosh when there is zero justification for it. You have zero proof that the atmosphere will be worse than it is now. That is what's truly shocking... you seem to think there is decent atmosphere there now!

BG is 1 price ticket hike away from becoming the new Library. Sad thing is we do not have any success so once our younger fans are priced even further out of the game we will fade and die. The club will be forced to hike its prices to compete with the other clubs and we will then demand cash rich owners to fund our expectations

Whilst Spurs Chelsea and Arsenal all have varied success and fill their grounds with people who have money.

Fulham did it all wrong they appealled to the day trippers then charged them £45-50! Who on earth would want to spend that to watch them?

People do not mind paying that sort of money for success and as we're not successful we should do the opposite to get people in. lower the prices fill the stand and build up our great steeped in History football club.
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

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The Rebirth wrote: With the new roof why not? if done correctly?

Well if those people add nothing to the atmosphere then there is nothing lost is there? But there is a financial gain from them being there. As I said you keep going on about atmosphere the BG is dull except a few pockets if the corporates fill the boxes, then we will gain more money in the long run.

BG and it's potential? What potential? what potentially will happen is we'll become an even smaller club in London.

You're obviously blind to this.

It has nothing to do with being bought by a rich arab. The move enhances our club globally and potential financial gains nobody here wants to become the new Chelsea.

Your arguments are fundamentally flawed and you're clinging to this atmosphere tosh when there is zero justification for it. You have zero proof that the atmosphere will be worse than it is now. That is what's truly shocking... you seem to think there is decent atmosphere there now!

BG is 1 price ticket hike away from becoming the new Library. Sad thing is we do not have any success so once our younger fans are priced even further out of the game we will fade and die. The club will be forced to hike its prices to compete with the other clubs and we will then demand cash rich owners to fund our expectations

Whilst Spurs Chelsea and Arsenal all have varied success and fill their grounds with people who have money.

Fulham did it all wrong they appealled to the day trippers then charged them £45-50! Who on earth would want to spend that to watch them?

People do not mind paying that sort of money for success and as we're not successful we should do the opposite to get people in. lower the prices fill the stand and build up our great steeped in History football club.
Your arguments are fundamentally flawed and you're clinging to this atmosphere tosh when there is zero justification for it. You have zero proof that the atmosphere will be better than it is now. That is what's truly shocking... you seem to think there is not decent atmosphere there now!
Answered with a clip of your own quote with 2 tweaks :wink:
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Re: Retractable seating at the OS

Post by The Rebirth »

mywhufc wrote: Your arguments are fundamentally flawed and you're clinging to this atmosphere tosh when there is zero justification for it. You have zero proof that the atmosphere will be better than it is now. That is what's truly shocking... you seem to think there is not decent atmosphere there now!
Answered with a clip of your own quote with 2 tweaks
Thing is Nige when I post I am stating what I think will or can happen not what WILL happen.

Becuase none of us really know. :wink:
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