1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

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Kent Bubble Blower
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Kent Bubble Blower »

Up the Junction wrote:I'll scan it when I get a mo.

Nothing in there we don't already know FWIW, just Helliar reiterating his earlier piece with no new evidence to substantiate it. Perhaps John could post on this thread and tell us why he's convinced his story is the correct one.

FWIW, Historical kits are still listing 'Article by John Hellier provided by David Smith & Kevin Slade' as a source.
Ironworx wrote:[As I understand it UtJ the pink kits were listed as 'Article by John Hellier provided by David Smith (?) / Kevin Slade' and that referred to the old article that never was....

I did look for a cached version of the site so as to check up on that for sure, but they were more recent than the pink kits....
This any good...?
http://web.archive.org/web/200703112331 ... United.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
It's taken from March 2007. All the pictures are "broken" but the one that's marked "1900-1903 (i,j,k)" is still on the HK server...
Image
(i)(j)and (k) are Kevin Slade, Spartacus Educational and John Simkin respectively.
Ironworx
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Ironworx »

Yes, excellent, that is a cached version of Historical Kits dating to the time of the pink kits...

It can be seen from it that the creditations for the pink kits were i) Kevin Slade, j) Spartacus Educational (John Simkins site) and k) John Simkin.

Which is odd as I thought Spartacus / John Simkin accepted the provenance of the kits from the HK listing and this tends to imply that it was the other way round.

We are still learning more.

I have found out that in 1901 WHU played in all of the Southern, Western, and London leagues (and indeed WHU reserves won the Western League in 1907) So I have contacted the Western and Southern leagues to see if they have historians that might be spoken to.
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Ironworx »

Look what I've just found.....

1900 Shirt. http://icwhsshirts.webs.com/apps/photos ... id=8844160" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And

1901/02 http://icwhsshirts.webs.com/apps/photos ... id=8844160" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

They're replica shirts but they're blue replica shirts.

Also now in touch with the Western League Historian which is another lead.
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Green Hornet »

Just an observation, I'm credited with supplying info on the Historical Kits site (for a different, lower league team I hasten to add). However, I was credited for a shirt I hadn't commented on.

It's certainly plausible they got it wrong on other occasions.

GH
Ironworx wrote:Yes, excellent, that is a cached version of Historical Kits dating to the time of the pink kits...

It can be seen from it that the creditations for the pink kits were i) Kevin Slade, j) Spartacus Educational (John Simkins site) and k) John Simkin.

Which is odd as I thought Spartacus / John Simkin accepted the provenance of the kits from the HK listing and this tends to imply that it was the other way round.

We are still learning more.

I have found out that in 1901 WHU played in all of the Southern, Western, and London leagues (and indeed WHU reserves won the Western League in 1907) So I have contacted the Western and Southern leagues to see if they have historians that might be spoken to.
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by WestHamByTheSea »

Well I certainly won't be singing any songs about toothbrushes around here for awhile...nor indeed in Rayleigh. :?
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Cuenca 'ammer »

A shirt, shorts, sox and a jock strap ???

:lol:
Ironworx
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Ironworx »

Green Hornet wrote:Just an observation, I'm credited with supplying info on the Historical Kits site (for a different, lower league team I hasten to add). However, I was credited for a shirt I hadn't commented on.

It's certainly plausible they got it wrong on other occasions.

GH
Yes. HK don't deny that they had it wrong, that's why they revised to blue. There are two issues subsequent to that, firstly where did the think pink come from exactly, ideally we should know that -and- while everything that I can find suggests blue with nothing pointing toward pink, there just isn't that 100% incontrovertible piece of primary evidence dating from 1900, 1901 or 1902...

Something like a match report in a newspaper, an original shirt, a mention in a programme or club handbook, league records, or something else along those lines...
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by mushy »

Up the Junction wrote:I'll scan it when I get a mo.

Nothing in there we don't already know FWIW, just Helliar reiterating his earlier piece with no new evidence to substantiate it. Perhaps John could post on this thread and tell us why he's convinced his story is the correct one.

FWIW, Historical kits are still listing 'Article by John Hellier provided by David Smith & Kevin Slade' as a source.

The same Dave Smith I presume that is asking the question as regards the pink kits in the programme!
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Up the Junction »

Ironworx wrote:Look what I've just found.....

They're replica shirts but they're blue replica shirts.
That's Mick Clifford's collection, IW.

If you look under the WHUFC/Kits 1900-2008 link here on KUMB you'll see images of every shirt in his collection (he sent us this some years ago, you'll note the earliest he had then was the 1920s shirt).

As Mick is (or at least was) a KUMB reader, perhaps he can fill us in on the background to these.
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Ironworx »

It's a wonderful collection UtJ and well worth anybodies time looking at it.

Mick tells me that he's convinced that the shirts were blue, and he says he has spoken with a relative of a 1900-03 WHU player who confirmed to him that the kit was blue...

It adds to the weight of evidence but it's not a primary source, and neither are the shirts which are replicas...

I'm beginning to despair at ever finding a primary source, perhaps the historian bloke from the Western League will come up with something - I'm not giving up :crest:
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Ironworx »

mushy wrote:The same Dave Smith I presume that is asking the question as regards the pink kits in the programme!
It would seen likely wouldn't it, the problem is as UtJ pointed out yesterday, that the answer is again only the opinion of John Hellier and not evidence from 1900-03.
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Georgee Paris »

I'm surprised all this information isn't documented in the vaults of West Ham United, possibly up one of the turrets. What we need is Indian Jones and the raiders of the lost kits and some crazy whip wielding archaeologist riding into Upton Park on an out of control train carriage chased by a bunch of heart grabbing, sword wielding bandits...wait a minute - Green Street 3!!! Where's Frodo's number? Get me Harrison Ford quick!!
Do da do do do da doo..
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by wayneo1974 »

Georgee Paris wrote:I'm surprised all this information isn't documented in the vaults of West Ham United, possibly up one of the turrets. What we need is Indian Jones and the raiders of the lost kits and some crazy whip wielding archaeologist riding into Upton Park on an out of control train carriage chased by a bunch of heart grabbing, sword wielding bandits...wait a minute - Green Street 3!!! Where's Frodo's number? Get me Harrison Ford quick!!
Do da do do do da doo..
Whenever I see georgee p has posted I alwasys have a look to see what has come out of that strange but funny mind.

You never disappoint :lol:
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Ironworx »

Georgee Paris wrote:I'm surprised all this information isn't documented in the vaults of West Ham United, possibly up one of the turrets. What we need is Indian Jones and the raiders of the lost kits and some crazy whip wielding archaeologist riding into Upton Park on an out of control train carriage chased by a bunch of heart grabbing, sword wielding bandits...wait a minute - Green Street 3!!! Where's Frodo's number? Get me Harrison Ford quick!!
Do da do do do da doo..
It's probably documented in any number of places if only we knew where - Club handbooks, match programmes, newspaper clippings, Southern and Western league records, maybe somebodies got an original shirt....

Trouble is we're talking about 106 to 109 years ago, even my grandfather wasn't born it's that long ago and he did remember huge ships being built as a child which can only be the last days of the ironworks.
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Cuenca 'ammer »

Does anyone think that Bobby, who's absence is conspicuous, stopped off in BKK getting a whole new load of moody Light Blue tops knocked out ???

:lol:
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Georgee Paris »

He is getting chased all around Sukhumvit Road by furious lady-boys that want there baht's back 'Mister bobby, Mister bobby this pink shirt got bigger b*llocks than me mister bobby'
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by upton girlie »

Not sure if this has been posted before...or genuine photo...but saw this on ebay:

West Ham United 1901 Team Photo

Photo, in case it disappears:

Image
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by mushy »

Ironworx wrote: It's probably documented in any number of places if only we knew where - Club handbooks, match programmes, newspaper clippings, Southern and Western league records, maybe somebodies got an original shirt....

Trouble is we're talking about 106 to 109 years ago, even my grandfather wasn't born it's that long ago and he did remember huge ships being built as a child which can only be the last days of the ironworks.

Were the ships pink?
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Green Hornet »

Just an observation on that 1901 Ebay Team Photo, the Goalie seems to be wearing a matching shirt. I wonder if that was the case in 1901 ?
Certainly by 1911 our keeper wore a different colour to distinguish him from the outfield players.
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Re: 1901/02 WHU Kit, It Was.................

Post by Cuenca 'ammer »

upton girlie wrote:Not sure if this has been posted before...or genuine photo...but saw this on ebay:

Well that's effin brilliant U. G. it merely confirms that what I said all along, we played in shorts, shirts, and sox (oh and the occasional jock strap..)

:P

Get back into moderating the Girls NSFW thread.. (notice your absence in the "Ludo" thread)...


:P
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