Ravel Morrison

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Re: Ravel

Postby claret parrot on Wed Feb 15, 2012 1:29 pm

What strikes me as ridiculous is charging him over the use of the word "faggot". It's only because we watch American films and TV that we even know what the term relates to. In England a faggot is just a meatball isn't it?

Even knowing what it means, it's still pretty mild compared to other euphemisms for homosexuals. He shouldn't have used it but it's a massive overreaction I think. You cannot legislate for what people think it just makes them more careful not to articulate their prejudices. The way to beat any form of prejudice is through education and that takes time.

Even so there are a great many people who are never going to accept that the thought of two hairy fellahs sticking their body parts in each others apertures is anything other than repulsive. That's ok of course provided they don't have the right to voice their opinion. :think:
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Re: Ravel

Postby MikeNewell'sOldBoys on Wed Feb 15, 2012 1:40 pm

Rio called Chris Moyles a faggot live on Radio 1 and escaped punishment.. http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2006/oc ... g.football
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Re: Ravel

Postby Up the Junction on Wed Feb 15, 2012 2:04 pm

claret parrot wrote: The way to beat any form of prejudice is through education and that takes time.

Unfortunately for many it's far simpler to condemn.
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Re: Ravel

Postby fester on Wed Feb 15, 2012 2:22 pm

I am a self-confessed homophobe (I'm sure UTJ stepped in and warned me about it a few years back) and I am sure there was nothing homophobic about Ravel's comments. He alledgedly may/may not have used the term 'faggot' but kids from the age of 5 years are using it just as a throwaway jibe and more relating to an English meaning of 'stupid person'. Ravel has been brought up in a different generation from most of us and his use of 'Twitter' is something that he has probably used for several years - who are we to condemn him for this.

The FA have got this all wrong and if it were a court of law there would be no other outcome than 'Not Guilty'.
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Re: Ravel

Postby Up the Junction on Wed Feb 15, 2012 2:26 pm

fester wrote:I am a self-confessed homophobe (I'm sure UTJ stepped in and warned me about it a few years back)...
King Guy wrote:KUMB's position on this is a disgrace and is making me consider stopping my premium membership.

Proving the old adage that however hard you may try, you just have to accept you can't please everyone all of the time...
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Re: Ravel

Postby Cuenca 'ammer on Wed Feb 15, 2012 2:30 pm

What is "KUMB's position" on this ?

On the bottom looking down, or on the top looking down ?

Just wondered like as I don't have a twitter account....
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Re: Ravel

Postby fester on Wed Feb 15, 2012 2:32 pm

I don't see how Kumb could ever be accused of anything other than impeccable behaviour. I keep my thoughts now as thoughts or have a joke when I'm out with friends and family. The real issue here is that Ravel has done nothing wrong.
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Re: Ravel

Postby Aceface on Wed Feb 15, 2012 2:32 pm

Got to say, I can't get too worked up about him being charged - you call someone a faggot then you're asking for it. Homophobia is as stupid as racism - if a footballer called someone a n*gger over Twitter then they'd rightfully face the consequences.

The grey area in this case is that he's 18 and there's as much chance he was using the word as a generic insult rather than with homophobic connotations, but when all's said and done, that's the risk you take when you use certain words that most people consider hateful. There's only a few of them, and f*ggot is certainly one
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Re: Ravel

Postby stammer on Wed Feb 15, 2012 2:33 pm

fester wrote:I am a self-confessed homophobe (I'm sure UTJ stepped in and warned me about it a few years back) and I am sure there was nothing homophobic about Ravel's comments.


Does that qualify you then :think:
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Re: Ravel

Postby Aceface on Wed Feb 15, 2012 2:36 pm

fester wrote:I am a self-confessed homophobe


Homophobia is ****ing bizarre. Other people being gay has literally not affected my own life one iota. I struggle to see how you could even have a strong opinion about it
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Re: Ravel

Postby Iron-worx on Wed Feb 15, 2012 2:37 pm

fester wrote:I am a self-confessed homophobe (I'm sure UTJ stepped in and warned me about it a few years back) and I am sure there was nothing homophobic about Ravel's comments. He alledgedly may/may not have used the term 'faggot' but kids from the age of 5 years are using it just as a throwaway jibe and more relating to an English meaning of 'stupid person'. Ravel has been brought up in a different generation from most of us and his use of 'Twitter' is something that he has probably used for several years - who are we to condemn him for this.

The FA have got this all wrong and if it were a court of law there would be no other outcome than 'Not Guilty'.


I read what he posted and it looked like a foreign language to me, whether that's a comment on him or on me I'll leave for others to decide....

To be perfectly honest until this arose I wouldn't have associated faggot with homosexuality.

I'm not even certain that I do in the light of it arising :think:
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Re: Ravel

Postby fester on Wed Feb 15, 2012 2:54 pm

Does that qualify you then


Yes because if I wanted to be hateful (which I don't) I would have used much different words. I don't think this forum is the right place to discuss why I am homophobic - I have supported West Ham for 40 years and this forum is for all things West Ham not for discussing whether or not homosexual sex should be considered a perversion or a natural part of a loving relationship (That hurt me to type).



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Re: Ravel

Postby goingunderground on Wed Feb 15, 2012 2:56 pm

It's all kicking off a bit.

https://twitter.com/#!/rghammer6/status/169748837005660161/photo/1

Ravel retweeted this guy's tweet concerning Macheda's tweet calling someone 'you stupid little gay'.

Mancs are up in arms about Ravel 'grassing' Macheda.

Tweet from Macheda has now been removed.

Expect this to hit press tomorrow...
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Re: Ravel

Postby neil_d on Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:08 pm

Surely this (as in the whole use of twitter by players) is something the PFA should/could be involved in? Even if just to give guidance to players on what they shouldn't be saying, how to deal with abuse etc.

(On that note, seems Carlton's tweets have changed style since he's been back on twitter. Much more about training and discussing tactics rather than any old thing. Maybe some PR training in action?)
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Re: Ravel

Postby the pink palermo on Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:08 pm

A number of the players using twitter are relatively poorly educated young "men" .They're kids really , lacking maturity and understanding of the power of words and there ability to inflict offence on others .

I'm not sure what schemes the FA run for young professionals , but I would quite like the idea if they ran seminars at all professional clubs across the country on the use of new media , the importance of maintaining a professional approach whilst "off duty" and the danger of getting sucked into cyber slanging with people they have never met .

Surely , educating, informing and persuading is a better use of the FA's time than charging and punnishing people who do not understand or may not understand what it is they have done wrong .

And I'm not saying Ravel has done anything wrong - he may have been calling someone a pork meatball for all I know , perhaps he has enough Brains :wink: for that .

Education is the passport to the future ,for tomorrow belongs to those, who have prepared for it today ............as Carlton X may have said on twitter .
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Re: Ravel

Postby swash on Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:15 pm

Should be written into players contracts that they are not allowed to have Twitter etc accounts, problem solved
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Re: Ravel

Postby Up the Junction on Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:16 pm

Education, education, education, Pinks :thup:

Not condemnation, condemnation, condemnation.
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Re: Ravel

Postby joyful on Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:19 pm

good old Carlton is doing the educating -- just told Faubert it's probably not a good idea to tell everyone where he's going for lunch!

I am a very recent convert to twitter -- but it's quite addictive -- and a hugely powerful tool for both good and evil. The spontaneity is what makes it refreshing though -- if all the players' remarks had to go through the PR wringer it would lose its charm.

I will offer free courses to any players who want to learn how to spell though! :)
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Re: Ravel

Postby hornsey on Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:22 pm

i'm as excited as everyone else to watch this guy play for us
but we shouldn't excuse his remarks in any context in an interview, a bar argument, on the internet
they are unacceptable and homophobic.

If this were Louis Suarez everyone'd be (quite rightly) up in arms but this kid is English and represents West Ham whether he likes it or not and that makes it an even bigger shame.
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Re: Ravel

Postby joyful on Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:28 pm

but we shouldn't excuse his remarks in any context in an interview, a bar argument, on the internet
they are unacceptable and homophobic.



WHat exactly did he say -- I think he just used the word "faggot" to respond to someone who had been giving him loads of much worse abuse.

Was the guy he abused actually a homosexual? Did Ravel know ? Or was it just the kind of playground insult that kids use all the time?

If the Daily Hatemail hadn't been their usual, lowlife, lazy, journalistic self the FA wouldn't have done a thing.
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