West ham United 2-3 Tottenham Hotspur (23/09/17)

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Wilko1304
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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by Wilko1304 » Sun Sep 24, 2017 7:02 pm

He is clearly our only centre back who can play with the ball at his feet, and played well yesterday.

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by Colours never run » Sun Sep 24, 2017 7:44 pm

He's bad with the ball at his feet, no better than Collins. Panics and often launches aimlessly once gets under pressure. Apart from heading when he does manage to get himself in the right position on rare occasions he's good, he's not much good at anything else in the Premier League.

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by wildkard » Sun Sep 24, 2017 8:01 pm

Also never understood the love Ogbonna gets. Beyond looking like a huge baby (which is pretty cool) he has nothing going for him. Thought he was the worst of the back three in the first half by some stretch yesterday.

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by Colours never run » Sun Sep 24, 2017 8:47 pm

It's mainly because he's a nice chap (which he is) and arrived after a handful or so of Italian International caps (in a poor performing Italian side of late struggling) and used to play a few games for Juve (a few from the bench) surrounded by superior players that made him look much better than he is and everyone knows Italians are generally the best defenders in the game. So with that rep he gets a lot of leeway but in reality in the Prem he's been poor a lot of the time. And then we offer him a lucrative new bumper 5 year contract. **** knows what the Club were thinking about tieing him down long term like that. We could well be stuck with him for another 5 years.

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by simonirons » Sun Sep 24, 2017 9:39 pm

Had to put up with a fair bet of stick from them today.

Harry Kane has now scored more career goals then our last 30 strikers combined.

Also, looks like Nobles has a bit of a mare...

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by Sir_Trevor » Sun Sep 24, 2017 10:13 pm

simonirons wrote: Harry Kane has now scored more career goals then our last 30 strikers combined.

If that stat is accurate, then that is a damning indictment on our transfer policy over the past few years.

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by simonirons » Sun Sep 24, 2017 10:21 pm

131 against 122.

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by Colours never run » Sun Sep 24, 2017 10:25 pm

Not always. A lot of that it is also due to injuries to our Strikers unlike Kane who plays so often for them. I've lost count how many games our Strikers have missed down the years.

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by simonirons » Sun Sep 24, 2017 10:27 pm

And let’s not forget at least half of those strikers were absolute dog *****

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by simonirons » Sun Sep 24, 2017 10:37 pm

I say half, but skimming through the list, I’d say only 10 of them haven’t been a complete waste of money (and that includes 2 for the future)



1. Ilan (free) from Saint Etienne - January 2010

2. Benni McCarthy (undisclosed) from Blackburn Rovers - January 2010

3. Mido (loan) from Middlesbrough - January 2010

4. Freddie Piquionne (undisclosed) from Lyon - July 2010

5. Victor Obinna (loan) from Inter Milan - August 2010

6. Demba Ba (undisclosed) from Hoffenheim - January 2011

7. Paul McCallum (undisclosed) from Dulwich Hamlet - January 2011

8. Robbie Keane (loan) from Tottenham - January 2011

9. Brian Montenegro (loan) Deportivo Maldonado - August 2011

10. John Carew (free) from Aston Villa - August 2011

11. Sam Baldock (undisclosed) from MK Dons - August 2011

12. Nicky Maynard (£2m) from Bristol City - January 2012

13. Sean Maguire (undisclosed) from Waterford United - January 2013

14. Andy Carroll (loan then £15m transfer) from Liverpool - August 2012 & June 2013

15. Modibo Maiga (£4.7m) from Sochaux - June 2013

16. Wellington Paulista (loan) from Cruzeiro - January 2013

17. Marouane Chamakh (loan) from Arsenal - January 2013

18. Danny Whitehead (free) from Stockport - June 2013

19. Mladen Petric (free) unattached - September 2013

20. Carlton Cole (free) unattached - October 2013

21. Marco Borriello (loan) from Roma - January 2014

22. Jaanai Gordon (undisclosed) from Peterborough - December 2013

23. Mauro Zárate (free) from Vélez Sarsfield - May 2014

24. Diafra Sakho (undisclosed) from FC Metz - August 2014

25. Enner Valencia (£12m) from Pachuca - July 2014

26. Nikica Jelavic (£3m) from Hull - August 2015

27. Emmanuel Emenike (loan) from Fenerbahçe - January 2016

28. Simone Zaza (£4.3m loan) from Juventus - August 2016

29. Jonathan Calleri (loan) from Deportivo Maldonado - August 2016

30. Antonio Martínez (undisclosed) from Valencia - August 2016

31. Ashley Fletcher (free) from Manchester United - July 2016

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by bubbles500 » Sun Sep 24, 2017 10:44 pm

What makes it even worse he's done it in half the time :lol:

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by TheHandOfDog » Sun Sep 24, 2017 10:53 pm

That list of strikers is scary.

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by simonirons » Sun Sep 24, 2017 11:01 pm

Spent about 50m on 31 players there. Averaging 1.6m a striker

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by simonirons » Sun Sep 24, 2017 11:03 pm

TheHandOfDog wrote:That list of strikers is scary.

Yup, an enormous waste of money on both cheap and short term fixes. - quite comical when you read the tripe our board claiming they know what their doing.

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by simonpaulthomas » Sun Sep 24, 2017 11:25 pm

I'd totally forgotten we had Chamakh at one point. Man alive...

Was Obinna actually a striker? I could have sworn he was a winger.

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by Colours never run » Sun Sep 24, 2017 11:43 pm

simonirons wrote:I say half, but skimming through the list, I’d say only 10 of them haven’t been a complete waste of money (and that includes 2 for the future)



1. Ilan (free) from Saint Etienne - January 2010


2. Benni McCarthy (undisclosed) from Blackburn Rovers - January 2010

3. Mido (loan) from Middlesbrough - January 2010

4. Freddie Piquionne (undisclosed) from Lyon - July 2010

5. Victor Obinna (loan) from Inter Milan - August 2010

6. Demba Ba (undisclosed) from Hoffenheim - January 2011

7. Paul McCallum (undisclosed) from Dulwich Hamlet - January 2011

8. Robbie Keane (loan) from Tottenham - January 2011

9. Brian Montenegro (loan) Deportivo Maldonado - August 2011

10. John Carew (free) from Aston Villa - August 2011

11. Sam Baldock (undisclosed) from MK Dons - August 2011

12. Nicky Maynard (£2m) from Bristol City - January 2012

13. Sean Maguire (undisclosed) from Waterford United - January 2013

14. Andy Carroll (loan then £15m transfer) from Liverpool - August 2012 & June 2013

15. Modibo Maiga (£4.7m) from Sochaux - June 2013

16. Wellington Paulista (loan) from Cruzeiro - January 2013

17. Marouane Chamakh (loan) from Arsenal - January 2013

18. Danny Whitehead (free) from Stockport - June 2013

19. Mladen Petric (free) unattached - September 2013

20. Carlton Cole (free) unattached - October 2013

21. Marco Borriello (loan) from Roma - January 2014

22. Jaanai Gordon (undisclosed) from Peterborough - December 2013

23. Mauro Zárate (free) from Vélez Sarsfield - May 2014

24. Diafra Sakho (undisclosed) from FC Metz - August 2014


25. Enner Valencia (£12m) from Pachuca - July 2014

26. Nikica Jelavic (£3m) from Hull - August 2015

27. Emmanuel Emenike (loan) from Fenerbahçe - January 2016

28. Simone Zaza (£4.3m loan) from Juventus - August 2016

29. Jonathan Calleri (loan) from Deportivo Maldonado - August 2016

30. Antonio Martínez (undisclosed) from Valencia - August 2016 - Jury out but good feeling about him

31. Ashley Fletcher (free) from Manchester United - July 2016


Ones I highlighted I think weren't a complete waste of time for the money and Robbie Keane was a coup under the circumstances although imnhindsight waste of time. A few were punts like Montenegro that didn't cost much at all. Still some stinkers though like Maiga and for the money spent on him I'm going to include Valencia with little impact whilst here. Sean Maguire looking back hindsight could also he excused when looking how well he's done since.

Danny Whitbread shouldn't even be on that list as he was brought in as a midfielder.

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by Samba » Mon Sep 25, 2017 2:48 am

Only saw it on motd but it wasn't as bad as I had feared.
I think Spurs were lucky to win.
Arnie's powerful run on goal should have been a stonewall pen. They got away with that.
Us losing Antonio was very lucky for them.
For their first goal Carroll shouldn't have been in that part of the pitch (& I agree with many on here who said he shouldn't have been on the pitch anyway, replacing Antonio) where he had to make a panicked blind pass in field & Kouyate shouldn't have let it go by him thinking that it was for someone else. It wasn't hit THAT hard.
That's 2 bits of luck, not good play by Spurs. The goal was then easy. I agree that the offside law is an ass but if that's the law about 1st phase, 2nd phase, there's nothing you can do. Kane gained an unfair advantage by being in an offside position in the 1st phase. Simple as that.
Their second goal was Carroll getting mugged waiting for the ball to come down near the halfway line but the resulting shot at our goal was well saved by Hart & could have rebounded absolutely anywhere. But no, it has to go STRAIGHT to the unmarked Kane, who couldn't really miss an open goal. So I consider that a lucky rebound, a lucky goal.
Their third goal came from a free-kick hitting our post because (I hope) Hart had it covered. Where that rebounded to, one of their players, was again, sheer luck. He takes a wildly off target shot that by chance hits & rebounds off our left back? player. Where does it fly off to? Could have gone anywhere but no, it has to go in-field finding Eriksen perfectly just in front of our penalty area with a clear line at goal. This was not clever, inventive play by Spurs. All 3 goals I consider, were very lucky & might not have gone in on another day.
Our first goal was made by a good header from Fonte & L'pea doing what we bought him for & our second goal a fantastic cross by Arthur & an unbelievable header from Kouyate that no keeper would have saved.
However, I DON'T think Carroll deserved a pen late on. I just think he jumped too early.
Both Reid & Nobles late efforts were very disappointing. Hit the bloody target.
So, I don't think they outplayed us at all.
Yes, we had a little luck with them losing a player but he wasn't unlucky getting sent off. He looks a bit of a liability on that performance.
Of course watching it on motd is totally different to watching it at the ground or even on sky.

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by richneal » Mon Sep 25, 2017 4:55 am

Second round here . . . we lost to a better team.

1. Good (and great) teams will capitalise on mistakes.
2. Spurs did exactly that - twice - and I'd argue it was twice with Carroll-related errors in the middle of the park where we gave the ball away.
3. We deservedly got punished for both of the errors that lead to goals.
4. Where we got unlucky was with Antonio picking up a strain and going off. Tough break, but that's the way it goes.
5. Hindsight being 20/20 it's easy to say we made the wrong change tactically and strategically with sticking Hernandez on the flank. This is the first striker we've had since Demba Ba or Ashton/Bellamy that really knows where the back of the net is - he needs to be able to get in the six yard box. His limitation is that he needs to be in the box. Dramatic prediction here - Hernandes will score us 20 a season if he's around the six yard box as a CF.
6. We have the choice to play to Hernandez's strengths or to stick him on the flank.
7. Appreciate we had to move to a plan B post-Antonio but the bottom line is that is never going to work against decent teams with nearly an hour to go.
8. If we are a couple of goals down with 30 mins to go I'd have no problem bringing on Carroll - that's exactly what could work as a high-risk strategy to nick a point . . . with the very real chance of conceding another couple.

Thanks to the wonders of space telly i've watched the entire match twice and to be fair, there were stretches where we played really well and took it to Spurs. All in all, this was a much better performance than most of what we've seen so far this season. I certainly don't see all doom and gloom - certainly not yet, anyways.

And that Kouyate goal was an absolute blinder - great finish and great work by Masuaku to get the ball in just where it should be. All in all an entertaining match.

Suggestions moving forward? I'd still like a 3-5-2 with Sakho and Hernandez up front. The rest of the team picks itself on the standard combination of form and injuries (i.e. lack thereof).

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by IronworksDave » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:02 am

Whilst we performed 'well' for the first twenty minutes what does that mean?

Well we set out with a back five (neither fullback went forward) and a midfield defensive three ... so eight defenders, and yes that worked well for a while ... however once the inevitable mistake/opportunity/brilliance happened for the opposition ... and when you ship 2+ goals a game that's always going to happen ... once that happened we were a beaten side for the next 40 minutes ....

Did injuries? referee's calls? substitutions? make a difference ... who can say, the harsh reality is when Spuds put on the gas we were second best by a very long way ....

3-0 down, playing against 10 men, and getting back to 3-2 ... credit for the effort but it's still zero points ...

The brutal truth is that at 0-3 versus eleven men I bet every single one of us was expecting 0-4, 0-5, or even worse ... that sadly reflects our true level ...

Challenging the top four ... you're having a giraffe ... staying up is what it's all about for us this season ...

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Re: West ham United v Tottenham Hotspur: Match Thread

Post by kayahammer » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:14 am

I thought Fonte played really well. Carried the ball forward, doubled up as a right midfielder at times, defended solidly, and seemed to play as if he had a point to prove.

Nobes, well I'm sorry to say it but again he goes sideways and back when the better option is forward. Slows things down too much. Would be good to bring off the bench to close a game out.

MA was great until he got injured.

The Pea is wasted out wide. Can't get into the game.

Why we didn't sell AC for 30m to the Chinese last Jan is beyond me.

The Cheik was amazing. MotM for me.

Arnie started well, but gets into strops and sulks while the play goes on around him.

Now MA is injured I'd like to see a front three of Arine (LW), The Pea, and Sakho (RW). Andy off the bench if need be.

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