Watford 1-4 West Ham Utd (12/05/19)

An archive of match day threads originally posted in the General Discussion forum.

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dplus91
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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by dplus91 » Mon May 13, 2019 11:43 am

sendô wrote:The red was also a clear red, Antonio through on goal running full pelt and the defender pulls him back by the shoulder.
Also, the MOTD pundits mentioned Antonio's touch taking the ball away from goal but that touch came AFTER the hand on his shoulder pulling him back. I can't see that being overturned. He had no chance of getting the ball and made a desperate attempt to somehow stop Antonio running through.

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S-H
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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by S-H » Mon May 13, 2019 11:48 am

I hope they don't overturn the red out of sympathy for him missing the final, they'd be setting a dangerous precedent id they did.

Ignore the fact that Watford have a final to play in for a moment, would people still be saying it should be overturned?

If they overturn it, it needs to be solely on its individual merit.

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by chigwells finest » Mon May 13, 2019 11:48 am

pleased we beat them , thought we did enough to win the game at our place missed plenty of chances

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by Beavis Danzig » Mon May 13, 2019 11:53 am

S-H wrote:Any news on Fredericks, what happened?
he was holding his strapped up hamstring. no reason to risk a tear.

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by mushy » Mon May 13, 2019 11:58 am

bowltorious wrote:Antonio's was a pen, he fell theatrically but the guy shoved him over, blatent pen. Also definite sending off for Holebas, last man. Obviously frustrating for him but pissed me off the way they were all saying it was harsh and it should get rescinded. Why? He got a deserved red and misses the next game, simples.
I was there and nobody around me immediately thought of it as a sending off, neither did the ref.
It was only when the linesman started signalling (after the decision had been made) that anyone thought he was going off.
I watched it again on TV and it was nothing more then a slight touch on the shoulder. Antonio went down far to easily again.
Very harsh sending off in my opinion.
I hope he wins any appeal.

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by Upton Carp » Mon May 13, 2019 12:01 pm

Anybody got a link to a replay of the full match, please?

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by S-H » Mon May 13, 2019 12:01 pm

Beavis Danzig wrote:
he was holding his strapped up hamstring. no reason to risk a tear.

Cheers, hopefully just a precaution then, and nothing to serious.

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by goa127 » Mon May 13, 2019 12:13 pm

S-H wrote:I hope they don't overturn the red out of sympathy for him missing the final, they'd be setting a dangerous precedent id they did.

Ignore the fact that Watford have a final to play in for a moment, would people still be saying it should be overturned?

If they overturn it, it needs to be solely on its individual merit.
Think the precedent was set many years ago when Billy Bonds was not suspended for the cup final despite getting sent off for swapping punches with Colin Todd.

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by chigwells finest » Mon May 13, 2019 12:15 pm

we did have a game at sunderland after the cup final though ? which i think he played in too

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by sendô » Mon May 13, 2019 12:18 pm

mushy wrote:I watched it again on TV and it was nothing more then a slight touch on the shoulder. Antonio went down far to easily again.
He pulled him back by the shoulder whilst Antonio was running full pelt.

Have you ever had someone pull you off balance whilst running full speed? There's not much you can do except fall over.

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by goa127 » Mon May 13, 2019 12:20 pm

chigwells finest wrote:we did have a game at sunderland after the cup final though ? which i think he played in too
Yeah, I think he was let off with a caution because of his previous good record! It was a long time ago so I'm not sure, but it was the most outrageous bit of rule-bending ever (thankfully)

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by Up the Junction » Mon May 13, 2019 12:32 pm

The opposition view: Watford
http://www.kumb.com/story.php?id=133531

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Albie Beck
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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by Albie Beck » Mon May 13, 2019 12:39 pm

mushy wrote:I was there and nobody around me immediately thought of it as a sending off, neither did the ref.It was only when the linesman started signalling (after the decision had been made) that anyone thought he was going off.I watched it again on TV and it was nothing more then a slight touch on the shoulder. Antonio went down far to easily again.Very harsh sending off in my opinion. I hope he wins any appeal.
mushy, you're normally pretty solid on factual analysis but I think the ref and lino were talking hence the pause, and there were really only two questions for them to decide:
- was it a foul? yes it was
- was he last man? yes he was

Holebas couldn't catch Antonio, pulled him back and committed a foul. Antonio was headed into the area, not away which would have been the only mitigation. I was there too and all of us were immediately saying "it's red, surely?".

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by Crouchend_Hammer » Mon May 13, 2019 1:02 pm

S-H wrote:I hope they don't overturn the red out of sympathy for him missing the final, they'd be setting a dangerous precedent id they did.

Ignore the fact that Watford have a final to play in for a moment, would people still be saying it should be overturned?

If they overturn it, it needs to be solely on its individual merit.
I would like to see the rule changed so that sending offs don't affect participation in a cup final. Let it roll-over to the first league game next season instead

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by S-H » Mon May 13, 2019 1:04 pm

I agree, Crouchy.

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by Johnny Byrne's Boots » Mon May 13, 2019 1:25 pm

Crouchend_Hammer wrote:
I would like to see the rule changed so that sending offs don't affect participation in a cup final. Let it roll-over to the first league game next season instead
I'd go further and make it so bans, and totting up of yellows, only apply to the competition in which they happen. Get sent off in a cup game? You're banned for the next round, not the next league game.

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by mushy » Mon May 13, 2019 1:37 pm

sendô wrote: He pulled him back by the shoulder whilst Antonio was running full pelt.

Have you ever had someone pull you off balance whilst running full speed? There's not much you can do except fall over.
Well as an ex rugby player (not any decent standard) , yes I have had people pull me back, and if you watch rugby matches it happens all the time without every player collapsing onto the deck.
I did think that the most likely cause of him falling was a clipping of the ankles but havent seen that on the replays.
Edit.
In fact have watched it from every angle, the best angle is the one shot from behind the goal we are attacking. I still cannot see any natural reason that Antonio went down, his legs just appear to go from beneath him, I cant see how a push/pull could have caused him to do that.
http://hlfc.veuclips.com/player/html/dH ... autoplay=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
From 4 minutes onwards
Last edited by mushy on Mon May 13, 2019 1:53 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by Crossd_Hammrs » Mon May 13, 2019 1:39 pm

Crossd_Hammrs wrote:....................

Well Watford's goal shouldn't have stood - both their players were in our half when Arnie kicked-off.
Image(click to thumbnail to enlarge).

..................................
Johnny Byrne's Boots wrote:Arnie was also in their half...
Arnie is allowed to be under the "newish" amendments to Law 8 :

"For every kick-off:
all players, except the player taking the kick off, must be in their own half of the field of play"


http://www.thefa.com/football-rules-gov ... rt-of-play" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;"
Last edited by Crossd_Hammrs on Mon May 13, 2019 1:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by mushy » Mon May 13, 2019 1:40 pm

Albie Beck wrote: mushy, you're normally pretty solid on factual analysis but I think the ref and lino were talking hence the pause, and there were really only two questions for them to decide:
- was it a foul? yes it was
- was he last man? yes he was

Holebas couldn't catch Antonio, pulled him back and committed a foul. Antonio was headed into the area, not away which would have been the only mitigation. I was there too and all of us were immediately saying "it's red, surely?".
Think you are mixing me up with someone else!
Point taken by the way, but for me it was harsh.

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Re: ⚽ Watford v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by Johnny Byrne's Boots » Mon May 13, 2019 2:10 pm

C_H :thup:

I think the last copy of the rules I looked at had a picture of a player wearing ankle high boots kicking a brown leather football on the cover.

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