Winston Reid

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James P
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by James P » Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:22 am

sutts07 wrote:When he signed his new deal he was 28, our best defender by some distance and Arsenal had been asking questions.

Had we not tied him down there would no doubt have been fans asking why the hell not.
You tie a 29 year old down for 3-4 years so as to give you some flexibility to reassess whether he still fits your needs in the twilight of his career. If you’re paying a 34 year old the same money you were paying him at 29 but his body is on the wane then you’re stuck with him because no one else will match his wages.

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Sloop John B
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by Sloop John B » Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:22 am

Yes let's not forget the amount of fappery that was going on on here as his contract was running down.... It made the Declan Rice contract saga look like a mature and reasonable discussion between people who held a solid grasp on the facts.

Hindsight is a hulluva drug!

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sutts07
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by sutts07 » Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:30 am

James P wrote: You tie a 29 year old down for 3-4 years so as to give you some flexibility to reassess whether he still fits your needs in the twilight of his career. If you’re paying a 34 year old the same money you were paying him at 29 but his body is on the wane then you’re stuck with him because no one else will match his wages.
I have absolutely no issue with us locking players into longer contracts than we need to, especially ones that cost us virtually nothing to start with. At the end of the day, you can always sell them on to someone, somewhere and it is much better to have them locked down as opposed to holding a gun to our heads every two seasons.

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James P
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by James P » Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:40 am

sutts07 wrote:I have absolutely no issue with us locking players into longer contracts than we need to, especially ones that cost us virtually nothing to start with. At the end of the day, you can always sell them on to someone, somewhere and it is much better to have them locked down as opposed to holding a gun to our heads every two seasons.
You can't sell them on though because if they are not the same player at 33 that they were at 29 then no buying club will match their wages and the player is unlikely to accept a pay cut.

You put players on long contracts on the upward arc of their career trajectory. Get Rice on a six year deal by all means. But you don't say to a 29 year old "this is what we think you're worth today and we'll pay you this until you're 35". It's a deal with absolutely no upside and lots of downside.

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Billydinho
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by Billydinho » Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:42 am

hammerman11 wrote:will be a shame if he is finished as he was good for us. I weish him the best.

if he is finished we need another CB asap.
Why? We’ve not been clamouring for one in his absence and no one was expecting him back any time soon.

With Diop, Balbuena, Ogbonna and Rice able to drop in there if needed, we have far more pressing area of focus.

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Colours never run
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by Colours never run » Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:42 am

It weren't the fact he was rightly given a new contract, it was the length of it that raised eyebrows amongst us at the time knowing his injury record.

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Re: Winston Reid

Post by sutts07 » Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:54 am

James P wrote: You put players on long contracts on the upward arc of their career trajectory. Get Rice on a six year deal by all means. But you don't say to a 29 year old "this is what we think you're worth today and we'll pay you this until you're 35". It's a deal with absolutely no upside and lots of downside.
CB's play well into their 30s, even at the very top level.
The upside is that you have locked in a quality player at the peak of his career for the foreseeable future and warned off any potential suitors.

He played 30 games for us and was our best defender in 16/17... played 24 games the season before and 29 before that... he was a natural leader, knew the club inside out and full deserved the contract he got.

I had/have no issue with the deal we offered Reid personally and I'll be gutted if he never plays again. So close to a testimonial too.
Last edited by sutts07 on Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:04 am, edited 3 times in total.

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simonirons
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by simonirons » Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:57 am

This is about the third time this has been mentioned in as many months. - great shame if correct.

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Sloop John B
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by Sloop John B » Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:13 am

James P wrote:You put players on long contracts on the upward arc of their career trajectory. Get Rice on a six year deal by all means. But you don't say to a 29 year old "this is what we think you're worth today and we'll pay you this until you're 35". It's a deal with absolutely no upside and lots of downside.
Consider how it might have played out...

The club offers 3-4 years...

Reid considering this may be his last contract say's I'll take 6 or I'm off...

Best defender at the club walks out the door for free signs for rival .

Board say... his wage demands weren't crazy but we couldn't agree on the length of the contract...

Fans say yes that's ok....totally reasonable business decision...carry on...

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spod
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by spod » Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:18 am

Chopper Reid. Total legend.
When his contract ran down, I thought we were going to lose our best defender for nothing.
I was delighted when he signed a new contract.
Yes, six years was really too much, but if you think of the economics at the time - paying wages for two years too many costs less than buying (and paying) a new centre back. So it was probably a risk worth taking.
Needless to say, it hasn't worked out.

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The Gibbins
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by The Gibbins » Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:30 am

At the time we were delighted with the contract and a club of our stature has to be that bold if they want to hold on to a player. Unfortunately there are risks and you take a gamble on a player being injury free. Hopefully it isn't true as he been an outstanding player for us but like a few top defenders over the years those injuries can take their toll.

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Re: Winston Reid

Post by Aceface » Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:34 am

Would be sad news if true, one of my favourite players of recent times.

That fall he took when he got injured looked gruesome even at the time. 

I will say it casts a different light on some people talking about him like a waste of space recently – long contract or not, can only imagine how tormenting it must be to be battling with the notion that potentially your career is over prematurely – he likely had another 5 years left in him when it happened.

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Re: Winston Reid

Post by S-H » Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:44 am

His contract was never about tieing him down though, he signed a new 6 1/2 year deal in 2015 when is contract was due to expire, and then his latest one in 2017..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winston_Reid
2014–15 season

On 20 September, Reid scored the first goal after just two minutes in a 3–1 win against Liverpool at Upton Park. In March 2015, Reid signed a new six-and-a-half year contract with West Ham, after much speculation over his future at the club, after being linked with London rivals Arsenal and Tottenham Hotspur.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/footb ... -2021.html


And then 2 years later..

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/footb ... tract.html
Reid only signed a six-year contract two years ago but West Ham are keen to reward one of their star performers, who currently earns a little over £30,000 per week.
He'd still have 2 years left on his original deal, so the decision to give him an extra 2 years on top did at the time seem very odd..

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MorthwylMawr
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by MorthwylMawr » Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:45 am

Be such a shame if he doesn't play for us again. Has been a terrific servant and part of our club.

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James P
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by James P » Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:51 am

Sloop John B wrote:Consider how it might have played out...

The club offers 3-4 years...

Reid considering this may be his last contract say's I'll take 6 or I'm off...

Best defender at the club walks out the door for free signs for rival .

Board say... his wage demands weren't crazy but we couldn't agree on the length of the contract...

Fans say yes that's ok....totally reasonable business decision...carry on...
He was already contracted until 2021 so he wouldn't have been walking out the door regardless.

But even if it was a possibility, Reid would have to be fairly confident he could get a fat deal for six years elsewhere if he's handing us that ultimatum. I really don't think he would do.

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Sloop John B
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by Sloop John B » Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:00 pm

James P wrote:He was already contracted until 2021 so he wouldn't have been walking out the door regardless.

But even if it was a possibility, Reid would have to be fairly confident he could get a fat deal for six years elsewhere if he's handing us that ultimatum. I really don't think he would do.
Oh hang on a second... the details are coming thick and fast now... you were suggesting they should have offered him 3-4 year deal...but are you really upset about the 2 year extenstion....

also... If he's been on 30k a week for most of his West Ham career we're talking about a player who cost us next to nothing, has been paid relative cheaply and has been for large parts an absolute lion for us.

WHAT ARE WE COMPLAINING ABOUT HERE!!!

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James P
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by James P » Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:09 pm

We're complaining about a bad decision being made in 2017. If Winston Reid had been a bargain up til that point we're not obliged to piss our gains up the wall on the basis that we'll still have done not too bad over the course of his career.

Giving 29 year olds large six year contracts is folly. Let's stop doing it.

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Re: Winston Reid

Post by S-H » Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:11 pm

James P wrote:We're complaining about a bad decision being made in 2017. If Winston Reid had been a bargain up til that point we're not obliged to piss our gains up the wall on the basis that we'll still have done not too bad over the course of his career.

Giving 29 year olds large six year contracts is folly. Let's stop doing it.
I have to agree, despite how good a player is, that is bad business especially when he still had four and a half more years on his existing deal. Give him a pay rise by all means but why add years to his contract?

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Re: Winston Reid

Post by Colours never run » Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:27 pm

Last winning goal scorer at The Boleyn. :crest:

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Sloop John B
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Re: Winston Reid

Post by Sloop John B » Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:55 pm

James P wrote:Giving 29 year olds large six year contracts is folly. Let's stop doing it.
Details... We gave a 28 year old a 2 year extension...

Quite possibly it was a parity clause being activated...who knows...or really cares... Reid's golden in my book!

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