VAR - yes or no ?

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Vic_Watson
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Re: VAR

Post by Vic_Watson » Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:23 pm

Intent/non-intent was too vague. Now it's black and white.

Crouchend_Hammer
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Re: VAR

Post by Crouchend_Hammer » Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:24 pm

Vic_Watson wrote:Intent/non-intent was too vague. Now it's black and white.
They have only changed it for attacking team hand ball that leads to a goal
Defensive handball still have the original laws,although the issue with the silhouette is obviously very confusing

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Slacking student
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Re: VAR

Post by Slacking student » Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:25 pm

What a depressing VAR discussion on MOTD2. What players and managers want is not the priority. Football is about the fans. There’s (ours) is the voice missing here.

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Faithless
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Re: VAR

Post by Faithless » Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:34 pm

Crouchend_Hammer wrote: They have only changed it for attacking team hand ball that leads to a goal
Defensive handball still have the original laws,although the issue with the silhouette is obviously very confusing
Yep so you can prevent a goal by use of the arm/hand under the old definition of the law but not score from it. So if Boly was to block a shot in his own box like that it'd be play on. Farce.
Slacking student wrote:What a depressing VAR discussion on MOTD2. What players and managers want is not the priority. Football is about the fans. There’s (ours) is the voice missing here.


Have to agree, it's like the powers that be have gone "you asked for VAR so we'll give you VAR - but not the kind of VAR you thought you'd get, with law changes you didn't ask for"

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thejackhammer
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Re: VAR

Post by thejackhammer » Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:35 pm

You can't blame VAR for the Wolves goal, the rule has been changed and it implemented it.

I think there's a bit too much drama going on here, most goals will be legit, probably about 90% won't be ruled out because of VAR, so not celebrating because of it seems strong.

The penalty against Man City, that's Rice's silly fault, not VAR.

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Samba
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Re: VAR

Post by Samba » Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:42 pm

I totally get the call to change the offsides to being a case of daylight or even clear daylight but will that actually solve anything? A fingernail offside is now offside but would a fingernail onside, then be onside?

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devonshire flu
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Re: VAR

Post by devonshire flu » Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:50 pm

No season tickets renewal from my family for this season: big price rise and the VAR from summer tournaments looked like making going to a game pointless. England's second goal against the Netherlands being chalked off was just a sick joke.

Big media push last week by the refs to say that PL VAR would not be so rubbish.

I'm going to be in London/Kent at the end of the month, and could easily buy a couple of tickets for the Norwich Match.

I'm not going to bother. If celebrating a goal or a penalty save is foolish, then what's the point of going to the game?

I remember being in the Clock End when Leroy Rosenior scored the winner - we all went absolutely crazy. These days, he'd score, you'd get your crossword out, wait for the VAR to tell you that they failed to find anything wrong with a perfectly good goal, then have a polite round of applause with handshakes all round.

goa127
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Re: VAR

Post by goa127 » Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:51 pm

The problem with the offside rulings is that it's turning it into a technical offence. That was why the revised the rule a good few years back because goals were being disallowed for teammates being offside. Now we seem to be straying back into the same territory, offside decisions given when no advantage was gained.

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simon1982
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Re: VAR

Post by simon1982 » Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:54 pm

They have only changed it for attacking team hand ball that leads to a goal
Defensive handball still have the original laws,although the issue with the silhouette is obviously very confusing[/quote]

So if 2 Leicester defenders went up in the air and it deflected off of one of their arms and the other hacked it clear would var have given a penalty to wolves

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e17
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Re: VAR

Post by e17 » Mon Aug 12, 2019 12:01 am

thejackhammer wrote:I think there's a bit too much drama going on here, most goals will be legit, probably about 90% won't be ruled out because of VAR, so not celebrating because of it seems strong.
Maybe take a megaphone into the stadium and shout “come on keep celebrating” when a goal is scored.

It might seem strong - but even just watching Citeh’s lot trying to work out how to react after their 3rd was disallowed yesterday was very very telling.

You say “too much drama” - I’d say that’s EXACTLY what we’re in danger of losing based on events in Stratford on Saturday afternoon

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Faithless
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Re: VAR

Post by Faithless » Mon Aug 12, 2019 12:04 am

simon1982 wrote:So if 2 Leicester defenders went up in the air and it deflected off of one of their arms and the other hacked it clear would var have given a penalty to wolves
Only if VAR decided that, when the ball made contact with the defenders arm, it was't in a natural silhouette - however they haven't, according to Peter Walton, got a natural silhouette template for when a player has jumped like today so it'd be a subjective VAR decision.

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Samba
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Re: VAR

Post by Samba » Mon Aug 12, 2019 12:19 am

If the introduction of VAR results in droves turning away from attending matches, watch something get done about it, pdq...

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Re: VAR

Post by Rays Rock » Mon Aug 12, 2019 12:30 am

Samba wrote:If the introduction of VAR results in droves turning away from attending matches, watch something get done about it, pdq...
Absolutely. Can’t agree more.
The draw for the English game around the world has always been the cut and thrust nature of it. If that natural frenetic rhythm is ruined and people stop subscribing around the world and choosing the slower but more technical spanish offerings VAR will be gone pronto when the bank manager tells the premier league chiefs how their account compared to the last few years.

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Cuenca 'ammer
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Re: VAR

Post by Cuenca 'ammer » Mon Aug 12, 2019 12:43 am

ray

hate to tell you mate, they have VAR in every major league now. England was the last I believe to adopt it.

I watched the same slow agonising delays last season (the first) in La Liga.


guess what ? same "toenail offside" calls denying goals. same no call at one end until there is a stoppage in play - penalty at the other end of the field cancelling out what we thought was a goal this end.

some of the calls were adding 6-7 minutes to a game and that wasn't 5 calls - it was 2 sometimes.

you cannot get away from it now.....

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Colours never run
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Re: VAR

Post by Colours never run » Mon Aug 12, 2019 4:52 am

Just wait until a worldie goal is scored, only to be questionably chalked off due to the tiniest of fine margins...

The game should be about goals, not trying your level best to rule as many of them out, which will happen if we are to play the game of being laser exact everytime. It's hard enough at the best of times to score goals, let alone at the highest level.

It's a can of worms, that just didn't need to be opened with a crowbar and I never ever saw widespread calls from fans demanding for it. This was pushed by the powers that be who don't really understand the game in its untouched purist form.

Rays Rock
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Re: VAR

Post by Rays Rock » Mon Aug 12, 2019 7:51 am

Cuenca 'ammer wrote:ray

hate to tell you mate, they have VAR in every major league now. England was the last I believe to adopt it.

I watched the same slow agonising delays last season (the first) in La Liga.


guess what ? same "toenail offside" calls denying goals. same no call at one end until there is a stoppage in play - penalty at the other end of the field cancelling out what we thought was a goal this end.

some of the calls were adding 6-7 minutes to a game and that wasn't 5 calls - it was 2 sometimes.

you cannot get away from it now.....
Is it !

Doh’, thats the game we once knew and loved, gone forevermore.
First it was my season ticket, next my subscription to Sky etc.. cancelled. The next step really will be not bothering to buy tickets at all. It’ll come to something when I can’t be bothered to find a stream for nowt !

But hang on, there is a place left. The lower leagues, with its terraces, dodgy burgers & onions.
I suspect the technology will be eventually whittled down to everywhere but the Non- League.

Just imagine how confusing and unappealing it will be for an 7 year old at their 1st game.
“Yeeeeaaaahhh, goooooaaalll”
“Oh hang on son, it’s gone to VAR, again”
“What was VAR again”
“Well it’s a thing to check if the goal scored, was allowed, remeber”
“Oh yeah, but Oh, but the ball went in dad, why is it not a goal”
“Errr, I don’t know yet !”
Another minute passes ...... VAR says no goal.
“Oh No, no goal Son, sorry it was offside”
“Whats offside ?”
“Well, it’s when a player goes beyond the last defender, before the ball is played forward by his team unless that player isn’t interfering with pl.... I tell you what, do you want some more crisps”
“Yes please, then can we go on the train again ?”
“Yes, Yes we’ll get on the train straight away. come on”

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kitthehammer
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Re: VAR

Post by kitthehammer » Mon Aug 12, 2019 8:50 am

VAR didn't seem to stop the amount of fouls city were committing off the ball or the ref giving them any yellow cards.In other words it doesn't seem to have stopped or changed anything, the big clubs will always get the rub of the green, with or without it. Much like rice's encroachment, they will will only judge on what they want to judge. Yes Fabianski was off his line but i bet if there was a penalty at the other end, encroachment from a city player wouldn't be considered. If its all still going to be a mess then id rather the games flowed and there being mistakes without VAR rather than there being mistakes with VAR and everything being contested.

HammerAl
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Re: VAR

Post by HammerAl » Mon Aug 12, 2019 10:03 am

I really don’t like VAR. It’s probably going to cause more controversy than the dodgy refereeing calls!

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jastons
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Re: VAR

Post by jastons » Mon Aug 12, 2019 1:47 pm

I think a few people on here will change their minds about VAR when it works in West Hams favour. I'm not talking about a game where we go on to lose 5 nil but a game against Chelsea or Tottenham, or FA Cup semi, when VAR correctly rules out a goal against us

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sanchoz
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Re: VAR

Post by sanchoz » Mon Aug 12, 2019 1:53 pm

Watched the game on Saturday on TV and when a VAR based decision was pending, you had the freeze frame image of an offside or not decision as part of the coverage but in the stadium you did not. For the penalty you have the replays as part of that VAR process but again those in the stadium are left to wonder why the penalty was being retaken.

Also, plenty of stoppages and players of both teams arguing with the ref after a decision had already been decided by VAR and the correct amount of extra time was not added on at the end of the game.

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