Is our squad better this season?

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HammerAl
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Is our squad better this season?

Post by HammerAl » Mon Oct 28, 2019 10:23 am

What are your thoughts?

2018/19: Fabianski, Adrian, Fredericks, Zabaleta, Masuaku, Cresswell, Johnson*, Diop, Balbuena, Ogbonna, Reid*, Rice, Noble, Snodgrass, Lanzini*, Obiang, Sanchez*, Wilshere*, Nasri*, Diangana, Antonio, Anderson, Yarmolenko*, Arnautovic, Hernandez, Perez, Carroll*

*Didn't feature in many match-day squads last season

2019/20: Fabianski, Roberto, Martin, Fredericks, Zabaleta, Masuaku, Cresswell, Johnson**, Diop, Balbuena, Ogbonna, Reid**, Cardoso**, Rice, Noble, Snodgrass, Lanzini, Fornals, Sanchez**, Wilshere, Coventry**, Antonio, Anderson, Yarmolenko, Holland**, Haller, Ajeti

**Unlikely to feature in many match-day squads this season

We've effectively swapped Adrian for Roberto & Martin, Fornals for Nasri, Obiang & Diangana and Haller & Ajeti for Arnautovic, Hernandez, Perez & Carroll.

Fabianski, Roberto, Martin, Zabaleta, Reid, Ogbonna, Noble, Snodgrass, Sanchez & Yarmolenko are all in their thirties. Cresswell and Antonio are turning 30 this season as well. I'm not saying that's OLD, but it definitely gets harder for the body and mind to get going again when you hit a certain age - I think I read somewhere that we had the third oldest squad in the league? The team is currently playing like they could possibly do with a bit of an injection of youth...

Taking all things into consideration, I don't think our squad has improved on last season.

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Knighter10WHU
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Knighter10WHU » Mon Oct 28, 2019 10:52 am

Our squad is worse than last season. We haven't replaced Obiang or Hernandez simple as that.

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funky chicken
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by funky chicken » Mon Oct 28, 2019 10:54 am

Nope Ive said so many times before it is pretty much the same team that scrapped into 10th by the skin of their teeth. So we were never going to be in the race for a European place.

The only differences is:

- We have slightly more height thanks to the Haller signing;
- Fornals was brought in to give us another attacking/creative option so we are not left short like we were when both Lanzini & Wilshere were missing;
- Lanzini is available so far, unlike last season. Although debatably not doing much anyway.

I couldn't believe the excuses some of our fans made to justify signing no one, saying we were missing plenty of players from injuries and our players needed a year to settle, so don't need many signings. We absolutely did need more signings.

You can say the likes of Everton didn't particularly sign anyone, but you seem to forget they finished above us. It's us that are the ones that need to improve and we haven't.

Pellegrini would've been better of signing an all action midfielder, instead of bringing in Fornals. And keeping Sanchez who is nowhere near good enough, Cresswell getting a new long term contract and Zabaleta crazily getting a new contract when we have Fredericks, Antonio can cover there and even young Ben Johnson having his career stagnated playing for the u23s slowing down his progress is beyond stupid.

And if we are not going to bring in a midfielder, would we have been better off keeping Obiang for another season as back up?

Not to mention loaning out Diangana who already looked good in pre season and leaving us short of pace is once again looking careless. He could arguably walk into our team at the moment!

The club as a whole also have this terrible attitude at always assuming 1-3 of our key players will always be available and won't lose any form.

If Fredericks is missing, who comes in? Past it Zabaleta. If Rice is missing who comes in? Past it Sanchez? If Anderson isn't delivering who is putting pressure on him? If Haller doesn't turn up who comes in for him?

We could've easily made a move to bring someone like Ryan Fraser in who players in Anderson's position, gives us good strength in depth and puts more pressure on Anderson as he knows if he doesn't perform he'll be out the team.

The owners have once again escaped criticsm from the stands and look like Pellers will be used as the sole scapegoat.

Yes I am rapidly losing faith in Pellegrini and I am starting to believe he is not the man to take us forward. But what would you say about any other club that plays in a 60,000 seater stadium and had only £25m as a transfer budget? They need to go otherwise this is as good as it'll get.
Last edited by funky chicken on Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:04 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Knighter10WHU
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Knighter10WHU » Mon Oct 28, 2019 10:59 am

funky chicken wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 10:54 am

The owners have once again escaped criticsm from the stands and look like Pellers will be used as the sole scapegoat.

Yes I am rapidly losing faith in Pellegrini and I am starting to believe he is not the man to take us forward. But what would you say about any other club that plays in a 60,000 seater stadium and had only £25m as a transfer budget? They need to go otherwise this is as good as it'll get.
For once I think the manager is more at fault than the owners. Pellegrini's signings, substitutions and 1 way of playing are our downfall this season. We have no backup, no second striker to bring on and change a game, no different options to change the style of our play.

The owners backed him last season and again gave him some money this season to further improve the squad. They are at fault for years of under-spend and over-promise but for me the last 2 summers they have backed the manager.

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funky chicken
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by funky chicken » Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:09 am

Knighter10WHU wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 10:59 am
For once I think the manager is more at fault than the owners. Pellegrini's signings, substitutions and 1 way of playing are our downfall this season. We have no backup, no second striker to bring on and change a game, no different options to change the style of our play.

The owners backed him last season and again gave him some money this season to further improve the squad. They are at fault for years of under-spend and over-promise but for me the last 2 summers they have backed the manager.

I agree the owners gave him a decent-ish amount last summer. But you honestly believe the small amount Pellegrini had this summer, which included player sales was hand on heart acceptable?

You deep down believe the owners did everything they could for Pellegrini and backed him to the halt in the summer of 2019!? Enough to help him push on from 10th, which remember he only just about achieved on the last day of the season, with Bournemouth and Palace breathing down our necks? You think that amount is enough to push us into a higher position in the table?

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Korea Hammer
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Korea Hammer » Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:13 am

Arnautovic was much, much better than Haller
Obiang was better than Fornals
Adrian was better than Roberto
Hernandez and Perez were much better than Ajeti

We are demonstrably worse in terms of quality, quantity, proven premier league experience and potential goals.

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Patito
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Patito » Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:33 am

I'll reserve my judgement until the end of the season.

Crouchend_Hammer
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Crouchend_Hammer » Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:42 am

Obiang and Hernandez are big losses IMHO
Trouble is, they were not getting regular football so wanted to leave. Could we have persuaded them to stay? Not so sure

Those two statements are obviously contradictory to a certain extent, but both provided something different to what we currently have, and when on form were very good

My opinion is that we as a team would have scored more goals so far if Hernandez had started every game vs Haller, but of course, what we miss most is his impact off the bench in tight games

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Patito
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Patito » Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:44 am

Crouchend_Hammer wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:42 am

My opinion is that we as a team would have scored more goals so far if Hernandez had started every game vs Haller
Not a chance IMO.

Johnzo
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Johnzo » Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:45 am

Korea Hammer wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:13 am
Arnautovic was much, much better than Haller
Obiang was better than Fornals
Adrian was better than Roberto
Hernandez and Perez were much better than Ajeti

We are demonstrably worse in terms of quality, quantity, proven premier league experience and potential goals.

If Haller continues his goal record, he'll be on for 15 -16 prem goals this season. You seem to forget that Arnie (who hit 10) went completely missing from November-April last season!

Obiang was shocking for us, baring half a season in 2016/17. Id much rather Fornals in the squad.

I agree with you on Adrian.

And Ajeti has played about 20 mins of premier league football this season. Although I do think we needed another, slightly more proven striker aswell. you cant lose 4 strikers and only bring in 2, which is what we done over the summer.

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Knighter10WHU
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Knighter10WHU » Mon Oct 28, 2019 12:16 pm

funky chicken wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:09 am
I agree the owners gave him a decent-ish amount last summer. But you honestly believe the small amount Pellegrini had this summer, which included player sales was hand on heart acceptable?

You deep down believe the owners did everything they could for Pellegrini and backed him to the halt in the summer of 2019!? Enough to help him push on from 10th, which remember he only just about achieved on the last day of the season, with Bournemouth and Palace breathing down our necks? You think that amount is enough to push us into a higher position in the table?
I think it was acceptable the amount they gave him this summer, not saying they back him to the halt, that much is obvious but I think it was acceptable the amount they spent yes. You can't just chuck £100M a season at new signings, look at Everton they have done that consistently for years and not really improved.

We could have pushed on to a higher position had Pellegrini not wasted £25m on Fornals and brought a proper centre midfielder instead. Also should have kept one of Perez and Hernandez.

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sendô
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by sendô » Mon Oct 28, 2019 12:44 pm

I think our starting XI on paper is better.

The squad? No, we've sold too many players and not replaced them. Centre midfield is alarmingly lacking in depth, and our defence continues to worry me.

HammerAl
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by HammerAl » Mon Oct 28, 2019 1:04 pm

sendô wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 12:44 pm
I think our starting XI on paper is better.

The squad? No, we've sold too many players and not replaced them. Centre midfield is alarmingly lacking in depth, and our defence continues to worry me.
2018/19:

Fabianski
Fredericks Balbuena Diop Masuaku
Noble Rice Obiang/Snodgrass
Antonio Arnautovic Anderson

2019/20:

Fabianski
Fredericks Balbuena/Ogbonna Diop Masuaku
Noble Rice Lanzini/Fornals
Yarmolenko Haller Anderson

I'm not sure if there's a huge amount of difference between the two. I'm not saying we needed wholesale changes, but the 2019/20 team lacks the pace and bite of the 2018/19 team.

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sendô
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by sendô » Mon Oct 28, 2019 1:11 pm

We're missing Antonio up front, badly. If anything, he's just so different from all our other players and offers that "plan b" that we constantly lack.

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steveyrockstar
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by steveyrockstar » Mon Oct 28, 2019 1:23 pm

Korea Hammer wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:13 am
Arnautovic was much, much better than Haller
Obiang was better than Fornals
Adrian was better than Roberto
Hernandez and Perez were much better than Ajeti

We are demonstrably worse in terms of quality, quantity, proven premier league experience and potential goals.
I missed the Palace and Everton defeats but why has the general tide of opinion seemed to have changed so much towards Haller? :? 3 or 4 weeks ago, he was being spoken of as being a fantastic signing with so much all-round ability.

Ribbot
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Ribbot » Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:25 pm

The arnie/haller argument is ridiculous. Arnie wouldn't play for us! He used every trick to stay out of the squad except for going on strike, and on the latter, if we had kept him for another season he would almost definitely have done so.

Arguing about whether we should have kept Arnie or not is just bonkers and no serious conversation on the matter can be had as it just does not sit factually with what happened with him.

Johnzo
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Johnzo » Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:30 pm

steveyrockstar wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 1:23 pm
I missed the Palace and Everton defeats but why has the general tide of opinion seemed to have changed so much towards Haller? :? 3 or 4 weeks ago, he was being spoken of as being a fantastic signing with so much all-round ability.
Its like every big signing we ever make.

We sign them and theyre the best thing since slice bread, going to score record goals etc

After a one or two dodgy games theyre shocking and arnt good enough :lol:

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Patito
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Patito » Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:32 pm

steveyrockstar wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 1:23 pm
I missed the Palace and Everton defeats but why has the general tide of opinion seemed to have changed so much towards Haller? :? 3 or 4 weeks ago, he was being spoken of as being a fantastic signing with so much all-round ability.
He still is, stevey.

His hold up play is superb but the guy is isolated. He's knocking the ball down to empty space at the minute and isn't getting any service inside the box either.

Crouchend_Hammer
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Crouchend_Hammer » Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:39 pm

Patito wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:32 pm
He still is, stevey.

His hold up play is superb but the guy is isolated. He's knocking the ball down to empty space at the minute and isn't getting any service inside the box either.
Whilst that is true, his movement in and around the box is not great
He isn't as stationary as Carroll, but it is not as though he loses his marker very often with clever movement either

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steveyrockstar
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by steveyrockstar » Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:43 pm

I've said it many times before but losing Hernandez as an option from the bench has substantially weakened us. He was pretty useless as a starter, but he could win us points.

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