Hugh Jargon II wrote: ↑Mon Jan 27, 2020 12:41 pm
If Moyes wants to remain in football for the next 10 years or so he would be mad to stay with us.
Not sure about that.
Managers who keep getting jobs after leaving clubs usually fall into 2 categories.... 1. Seen as Tempermental but genius, 2. Seen as Reliable and safe.
Moyes is definitely in the second pile. It's been many years and many jobs since he was a raging success, doesn't do much special tactically, but seen as a reliable old hand to come in, not rock the boat and grit out some draws to stay up.
Quitting after a month or two is some Bielsa stuff, it makes owners nervous. Bielsa gets away with it because he's widely acknowledged as a mad genius and he has a long history of laying great foundations very quickly at clubs, so it's worth the chance.
Moyes' best move in terms of securing future employment is likely to plug away, talk some about how he's disappointed about the window, hope to keep us up. HOWEVER, he might rightly think that his pride and fairness obligate him to walk away. Probably not great for his managerial future, but also probably a lot easier for him to live with.
True to form (and performance), Moyes reverts back to predictable type as an utterly clueless managerial dinosaur. We really are living in the twilight zone right now, what with everything bad that is going on at the Club. Those c**** in charge seem to be in a competition all of their own in how to f*** it all up when deciding issues at the Club. The sooner the lot of them, including their desperate pal who has no managerial integrity anymore, the quicker we might be able to save what's left of our once great Club.
David Sullivan, the club’s powerful co-owner, has resumed control of transfer negotiations and is under increasing pressure to get an unbalanced, injury-hit squad out of a hole.
So Sullivan will take the blame if we don't bring enough quality this week then?
Colours never run wrote: ↑Mon Jan 27, 2020 1:29 pm
True to form (and performance), Moyes reverts back to predictable type as an utterly clueless managerial dinosaur.
You're holding Moyes responsible for not starting a load of ball-playing, goal-scoring, attacking players in our recent fixtures?
chalks wrote: ↑Sun Jan 26, 2020 10:57 am
I’m hearing, quite reliably, that Moyes is waiting until the deadline passes before bringing anymore staff in
The reason? Broken promises on transfer funds.
We’ll be looking for another manager from next Sat, which would hopefully have the press finally outing these thieving ***** for what they really are
If he does go, he will go up in many people's estimation and hopefully the media and all will actually go after GSB and the way they operate. BFS slip this morning about Dave's presents, the sunday supplement piece, Joe Cole/McNanaman and a few newspaper/website articles are showing the cracks appearing.
Cannot believe though we have one assistant and one goalkeeper coach. What is the norm setup at a premiership club?
sussexhammer74 wrote: ↑Mon Jan 27, 2020 1:53 pm
If he does go, he will go up in many people's estimation and hopefully the media and all will actually go after GSB and the way they operate. BFS slip this morning about Dave's presents, the sunday supplement piece, Joe Cole/McNanaman and a few newspaper/website articles are showing the cracks appearing.
Cannot believe though we have one assistant and one goalkeeper coach. What is the norm setup at a premiership club?
Liverpool have the following listed on their site just for the first team:
2 assistant managers
GK coach
Assistant GK coach
Development coach
Fitness and Development coach
Rehab Fitness coach
Post-match analyst
Head of opponent analytics
Plus a medical team, physio team, nutritionist, etc.
Leicester have:
Assistant manager
2 First team coaches
GK coach
Fitness coach
Plus all the other medical, physio team, analysts, player liason, etc.
Most sides have a handful of coaches and then extensive medical, physio, scouting and analyst teams. So we're probably only a coach or two short in the coaching department, who knows on the rest since we don't put it on the website but I'd assume at the very least we have little in the scouting and analyst areas.
Cellar-door wrote: ↑Mon Jan 27, 2020 1:18 pm
Not sure about that.
I would tend to agree with Hugh here for the moment tbh. Moyes wants to rebuild his reputation and prove he can manage in the Premier League. Going down with us isn’t the way to do that. The only thing in his favour is that the owners are starting to get exposed. If it gets to the point that the pressure Is really on them, then I guess Moyes has a free hit. Go down and hopefully the owners continue to get the blame until they f*** off. Stay up in spite of them? Well, that would go some way to doing so.
If we deliver 2/3 signings before the end of the window then the pressure goes back to Moyes. The board will say they have delivered signings to help. Best thing is to see ex players/managers/journalists digging at them everyday.
il_martello_di_genovesi wrote: ↑Mon Jan 27, 2020 2:08 pm
I would tend to agree with Hugh here for the moment tbh. Moyes wants to rebuild his reputation and prove he can manage in the Premier League. Going down with us isn’t the way to do that. The only thing in his favour is that the owners are starting to get exposed. If it gets to the point that the pressure Is really on them, then I guess Moyes has a free hit. Go down and hopefully the owners continue to get the blame until they **** off. Stay up in spite of them? Well, that would go some way to doing so.
If we deliver 2/3 signings before the end of the window then the pressure goes back to Moyes. The board will say they have delivered signings to help. Best thing is to see ex players/managers/journalists digging at them everyday.
I think he's put himself in a poor position already though is the issue.
Not sure he was likely to get a PL job before this, how would a month or 2 of poor performances and then quitting help his position? At least if he sticks it out he can look to Scotland or something to try again. if he quits, justified or not owners at other teams are going to see that as a strike against him (quit 2 jobs as soon as things got difficult will likely be the spin they use) and he'll struggle to find a job anyway.
I think if I were him I'd be willing to quit, but I'd also know that it was probably not a move that helped my chances of getting another big job in managing.
LeonRivers wrote: ↑Mon Jan 27, 2020 1:52 pm
You're holding Moyes responsible for not starting a load of ball-playing, goal-scoring, attacking players in our recent fixtures?
I'm holding him responsible for incredibly dull, defeatist, dogshit football since his first game back in charge, which usually gets a positive reaction from players trying to impress a new manager in our recent fixtures. And it's de ja vu as we had to endure it all before.
Most sides have a handful of coaches and then extensive medical, physio, scouting and analyst teams. So we're probably only a coach or two short in the coaching department, who knows on the rest since we don't put it on the website but I'd assume at the very least we have little in the scouting and analyst areas.
It's been well documented since Pellegrini left we only half 1 scout.
Liverpool have the following listed on their site just for the first team:
2 assistant managers
GK coach
Assistant GK coach
Development coach
Fitness and Development coach
Rehab Fitness coach
Post-match analyst
Head of opponent analytics
They have these as I’m sure I read that the under 21s train with the first team all the time. Not a bad idea that.
peter49uk wrote: ↑Mon Jan 27, 2020 3:01 pm
They have these as I’m sure I read that the under 21s train with the first team all the time. Not a bad idea that.
This doesn't include youth coaches.
Beyond the general academy coaches and the U18 coaches they also have:
U23 coach
U23 GK Coach
U23 Individual coach
U23 Fitness Coach
U23 Rehab Fitness Coach
Plus dedicated Physios for the U23 and separate U18 Physios
Total between First Team and Academy they have 62 staff members listed on their website. It's been one of the real changes in having FSG take over, they brought in the model from their baseball team. The realization was that you get better coaching with specialization and individual attention instead of one or two coaches trying to coach every aspect to every player. It's incredibly smart honestly. You spend tens even hundreds of millions on players and you want to get the absolute most from them. Why take a chance on not getting that in order to save thousands on coach salaries.
Hugh Jargon II wrote: ↑Mon Jan 27, 2020 12:41 pm
If Moyes wants to remain in football for the next 10 years or so he would be mad to stay with us.
I think we might want to remind ourselves what he in fact did between finishing up with us at the end of the 2017-18 season and taking on the job after we fired Pellegrini. Surely that's a better guide to his future job prospects?
chalks wrote: ↑Sun Jan 26, 2020 10:57 am
I’m hearing, quite reliably, that Moyes is waiting until the deadline passes before bringing anymore staff in
The reason? Broken promises on transfer funds.
We’ll be looking for another manager from next Sat, which would hopefully have the press finally outing these thieving ***** for what they really are
If this is true, watch Karen "move on to other projects, having achieved so much". She'll be out of town like **** through a goose
My only caveat with this is , Moyes has worked with these shysters before, he knows how it works, like him or loathe him he's no fool. Surely he cannot have joined expecting them to part with money at any point
peter49uk wrote: ↑Mon Jan 27, 2020 3:01 pm
Liverpool have the following listed on their site just for the first team:
2 assistant managers
GK coach
Assistant GK coach
Development coach
Fitness and Development coach
Rehab Fitness coach
Post-match analyst
Head of opponent analytics
They have these as I’m sure I read that the under 21s train with the first team all the time. Not a bad idea that.
We should have that as minimum, it's obviously working for Liverpool and I bet the more successful teams in the league have a similar set up.
woodford wrote: ↑Mon Jan 27, 2020 5:28 pm
If this is true, watch Karen "move on to other projects, having achieved so much". She'll be out of town like **** through a goose
My only caveat with this is , Moyes has worked with these shysters before, he knows how it works, like him or loathe him he's no fool. Surely he cannot have joined expecting them to part with money at any point
Just like the players, he will stay for the money.