The summer transfer window 2019 thread

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stammer
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by stammer » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:03 am

bubbles1966 wrote:This defeatism - this desire to sell and capitulate at the first sign of any interest in a player - is doing my nut in.

We deserve to be crap if that's what we are and who we are.
The signal sent throughout the team is not great stepping stone Utd and/or we aren’t looking to be anything. You cannot build a really good team with constant chop and change no matter how good the swaps.

ashbanki
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by ashbanki » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:03 am

There is a huge premium on overseas players with potential, after a successful season in the PL - Which ,invariably, means that the "replacement" will be a risk, no matter how good or potentially good that player is - settling in to new country,adapting to the speed and intensity of the PL,imo.

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EastVillageHammer
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by EastVillageHammer » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:15 am

ashbanki wrote:There is a huge premium on overseas players with potential, after a successful season in the PL - Which ,invariably, means that the "replacement" will be a risk, no matter how good or potentially good that player is - settling in to new country,adapting to the speed and intensity of the PL,imo.
All well and good suggesting it was defeatist, but it is realism in my opinion. I wouldn’t advocate selling any of our best players if we didnt live in a world where united have 10 times more money than us. If we sell high, buy low, we decrease the gap between us and the top teams.

If United spend big to stay still, and we can reinvest that to spend 40 million consistently every season, that’s how we grow. It’s really just pragmatism. We should have sold Arnie at 30 million if that bid really existed. He’s a depreciating asset, but that’s just my opinion.

Best will in the world, I’m sure Pelle and Husillos will be able to figure this one out better than you or I. Balbuena and Diop didn’t struggle.

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hammer1975
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by hammer1975 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:16 am

EastVillageHammer wrote: If we are to emulate clubs like Spu** then we have to sell players at some stage when the value bidder exceeds their worth to the team. I trust Pelle and Husillos if they sell Diop for 65 million to know of a defender at 24 million who can come in and do a good job.
Ultimately I trust Pelle and Husillos - it’s the dude owning the chequebook that I don’t trust. Can you imagine behind the scenes if Sulli wants to sell and Pelle doesn’t? First bad game for Diop or an injury and we’ll hear all about it being Pelle who didn’t want to sell. There is already stuff on social media with propaganda about the ‘loss’ we’re going to make this year and constant criticism of Lanzini in what looks like an attempt to create a desire from the fanbase to sell (imo).

If we want to emulate spurs then we need to keep our best players - that’s what they’ve done with Kane, Eriksen and Lloris (all linked with Barça and Real Madrid), they’ve also kept Son, Alderweireld, Verthongen, Rose despite all of them being linked with ‘bigger’ clubs like Man Utd, PSG etc. As i’ve posted repeatedly the key point to their success was spending a large amount of money over a sustained period. £280m net more than us over 10 years.....they may well have had some high profile sell-to-buy but they wouldn’t have moved from mid table to top six without spending so heavily.

This ‘sell-to-progress’ model is stuff of fantasy imo - there is literally no example of sustained success from it. There are lots of examples of spending more money net than your peers helping you progress though.

Keep Diop, improve the team around him.
Last edited by hammer1975 on Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Chicken Run Supreme
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by Chicken Run Supreme » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:18 am

I cannot think of an example of any time in the past when we've had an in-demand player that had been sold on and as a result of the deal, be it straight cash or player swap, or a combination of both, where we have ended up improving our squad. United will only be offering us shyte players, as we did to WBA.
Diop sale would set us back.

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Ozza
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by Ozza » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:23 am

It’s not as simple as people make out, spuds as an example need to shift Eriksson and TA as both have refused to sign new deals.

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Het-Field
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by Het-Field » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:27 am

Chicken Run Supreme wrote:I cannot think of an example of any time in the past when we've had an in-demand player that had been sold on and as a result of the deal, be it straight cash or player swap, or a combination of both, where we have ended up improving our squad. United will only be offering us shyte players, as we did to WBA.
Diop sale would set us back.
We sold Hartson for a decent markup, and purchased Minto, Di Canio, and Foe with the proceeds.

But that was 20 years ago. The Rio money was essentially wasted with only Daily becoming a long term squad member.

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OllyWHU6
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by OllyWHU6 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:29 am

Keep Diop. Bid for McTominay if we like him. Why let them unsettle us, turn it on them instead.
We seem to be a team willing to give younger players a chance (Diop, Rice, Diangana last season) talk about that publicly and why we would be a good fit for a player to develop at unlike the stagnation of an inexperienced manager at a big club.

It’s not even about money at this point with Diop, it’s about why let a direct rival for 5th-10th get better at our expense. Unless they go beyond good deal into a ridiculous offer that cripples their spending elsewhere then don’t budge.

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Chicken Run Supreme
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by Chicken Run Supreme » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:31 am

I remember getting a decent fee for John Hartson. To be honest, you could forget about Minto, DiCanio alone with the proceeds was a big step forward, chuck in Foe and that really was good business.
Well remembered :thup:

ashbanki
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by ashbanki » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:33 am

Sullivan maintaining "We don't have to sell" in the past was quite an easy promise to keep, as many of the players he brought and gave huge wages to were unsellable anyway!
I'm sure Diop will stay for another season,at least - Pellegrini will get him in the French squad quicker than Ole G and his replacement will.This is the time to buy into Pellegrini and back him, not cash in,imo.

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wivenhoetim
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by wivenhoetim » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:35 am

I have a very pragmatic view of interest in the likes of Diop. For me it says a couple of things, one, are recruitment under Pelle is clearly successful, he and his scouting team are probably the best we’ve had. And secondly, without big clubs looking at our players and valuing them way beyond what we’re used to surely just gives us the opportunity strengthen across the team. The alternative is that we are seen as a team with players nobody rates or wants, you can’t have it all ways. Sure we all have our views of who should come in and who should go...and at what price, but these things take time, it’s a multi million pound business with more at stake than ever before.
Ultimately there are only two questions we need to ask ourselves, do we have confidence in what appears to be the best, most respected management team we’ve had in for a long time to improve the team, and then, probably more importantly, do we have confidence in the board to let them do that. If the answer to the second question is no, I think we may have already had a sniff of that as Pelle ain’t gonna roll over for anybody in my opinion. In truth I have never been more optimistic about a transfer window, and look forward to seeing how it develops. Blind optimism maybe, but hey the suns out and Fornals ain’t too shabby either! Onwards and upwards I say.

happy.hooker
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by happy.hooker » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:49 am

Voronin wrote:Unless they’re offering Lukaku, I’m not interested in a part exchange deal.
What is the most own goals scored in one season? :D

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OohAahButler
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by OohAahButler » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:51 am

I don’t think it’s defeatism if the money is properly reinvested in the team. I’d rather call it ‘pragmatic development.’

I’m not advocating potentially selling Diop for stupid money because I want to kowtow to the big boys. I’m suggesting that, with £65m in our pocket, we can close the deals for Gomez, Maripan or whoever else Pell has prioritised, and still have cash left over for (for example) a new left back.

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pezza20
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by pezza20 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:59 am

Yawn ... Diop is not for sale.

Rasp
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by Rasp » Sat Jun 29, 2019 11:02 am

pezza20 wrote:Yawn ... Diop is not for sale.
haha

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Calverley Hammer
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by Calverley Hammer » Sat Jun 29, 2019 11:05 am

OohAahButler wrote:I don’t think it’s defeatism if the money is properly reinvested in the team. I’d rather call it ‘pragmatic development.’

I’m not advocating potentially selling Diop for stupid money because I want to kowtow to the big boys. I’m suggesting that, with £65m in our pocket, we can close the deals for Gomez, Maripan or whoever else Pell has prioritised, and still have cash left over for (for example) a new left back.
But having Diop makes those deals more likely.

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S-H
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by S-H » Sat Jun 29, 2019 11:05 am

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carnage
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by carnage » Sat Jun 29, 2019 11:19 am

Peaches

Your post is long and good, the only issue with it is that the last thing we need as a team is to be “a bit weaker at centre back.”

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carnage
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by carnage » Sat Jun 29, 2019 11:21 am

If Diop has a price tag of £65 million, Rice more, Fabianski Hammer of the year, Balbuena not far behind, Zab consistent, why do we concede so many goals? Probably worth it’s own thread to be honest.

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StevePottsGoalsReel
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Re: The summer transfer window 2019 thread

Post by StevePottsGoalsReel » Sat Jun 29, 2019 11:21 am

Chicken Run Supreme wrote:I cannot think of an example of any time in the past when we've had an in-demand player that had been sold on and as a result of the deal, be it straight cash or player swap, or a combination of both, where we have ended up improving our squad. United will only be offering us shyte players, as we did to WBA.
Diop sale would set us back.
Could probably add Julian Dicks to the Hartson sale mentioned, although that was partly because we got him back again later.

Didn't we also effectively swap Reo-Coker out for Scott Parker and make a profit?

Make you right though of course. The fact any of these examples are so few and far between says it all.

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