Is our squad better this season?

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Patito
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Patito » Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:44 pm

Crouchend_Hammer wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:39 pm
Whilst that is true, his movement in and around the box is not great
He isn't as stationary as Carroll, but it is not as though he loses his marker very often with clever movement either
His goals against Palace, Norwich and Watford are all clear examples of him losing his marker to tap home. The issue (imo) is the lack of decent service rather than his movement. One of a number of issues we have currently.

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Korea Hammer
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Korea Hammer » Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:54 pm

Ribbot wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:25 pm
The arnie/haller argument is ridiculous. Arnie wouldn't play for us! He used every trick to stay out of the squad except for going on strike, and on the latter, if we had kept him for another season he would almost definitely have done so.

Arguing about whether we should have kept Arnie or not is just bonkers and no serious conversation on the matter can be had as it just does not sit factually with what happened with him.
This keeps getting twisted. The question was not whether we "should have kept Arnie", it's whether our squad is stronger or weaker. The fact that he didn't want to be here has got nothing to do with this thread.

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funky chicken
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by funky chicken » Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:56 pm

To put this pathetic excuse of Hernandez earned us points off the bench argument to bed, he only debatably did it TWICE last season.

1) West Ham 4-2 Burnley - which we may have won anyway as if you take his goal away it's still a 3-2 win;

2) West Ham 4-3 Huddersfield - unquestionably he earned us the 3 points as he got the all important goals to level us and win us the game.

So he arguably only earned us THREE measly points off the bench throughout the whole of last season.

Are we sure we are missing him? :?

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il_martello_di_genovesi
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by il_martello_di_genovesi » Mon Oct 28, 2019 3:11 pm

Hernandez averaged 8 goals per season with us. While not massive numbers it’s important enough that it needed to be replaced. Even Perez got 3. We have replaced them with Ajeti who doesn’t get anywhere near the minutes that Hernandez got for example. So we’ve basically thrown 8-11 goals away as it stands unless Ajeti gets a run and starts scoring. An all fit XI and we are better than last season for sure. The squad overall? I don’t think so. We’ve had 2 major injuries this season to key players and don’t have anything to replace what they offer to a similar standard...

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thejackhammer
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by thejackhammer » Mon Oct 28, 2019 3:34 pm

Korea Hammer wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:13 am
Arnautovic was much, much better than Haller
Obiang was better than Fornals
Adrian was better than Roberto
Hernandez and Perez were much better than Ajeti

We are demonstrably worse in terms of quality, quantity, proven premier league experience and potential goals.
1. Harsh, and on pedigree, false. Look at their overall careers, Haller will come good.

2. Again harsh, again look at their respective careers, Obiang wouldn't get near the spanish national side. They are completely different players mind.

3. True, but I don't think it's by much. Anyone would look good behind the Liverpool defence.

4. Perez, very harsh. Hernandez just never looked comfortable here, he always wanted to leave and I doubt he'd have seen anymore minutes than Ajeti has. We're also judging Ajeti on very little time.

All of 3 weeks ago the majority had Haller as our best striker of recent times, Roberto wasn't going to get a game but looked decent against Newport, and people were actually willing to give Ajeti and Fornals time. It's amazing what a minor dip in form can do to perception.

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Estuary
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Estuary » Mon Oct 28, 2019 3:49 pm

An all fit 11 has only one starer who wasn't in last seasons squad, Haller, who while promising doesn't possess Arnies pace or ability, his goal record is better, but it's yet to be seen if he will be able to repeat that in the PL.
But the squad is weaker due to lack of depth, the loss of Obiang, Hernadez and Perez hasn't been addressed like for like. Fornals looks like a good investment, but we are over manned in the attacking midfield area and needed a central midfield player more, so why buy him if, as appears, it was a choice? Ajeti isn't as good as the two forwards we let go, he's just cheaper.

That said we are 5 points better off at present so maybe squad building is not the be all and end all.

We miss Antonio big time currently. I will go so far to say that we would be at least four points better off had he stayed fit. But that's the West Ham way, .....if.

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englebert
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by englebert » Mon Oct 28, 2019 4:06 pm

Our squad is not better than last season. That's why we are tenth. I would say that the overall squad is weaker, but its balanced by the return of Lanzini. (Yarmo return balanced by Antonio loss)

There is not enough investment by the club in the paying staff, no matter how much they like to dress it up.

Pellers is not a magician, although i am relatively happy with him.

I am just happy that we currently are not in a relegation battle, and we pass the ball on the ground

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MooresTheHero
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by MooresTheHero » Mon Oct 28, 2019 4:15 pm

I like Haller and think (with the right support) could be our new Dean Ashton (hopefully without the knackered ankles). Watching him recently though, and he seems frustrated.

I can't understand the purchase of Fornals, unless Lanzini is expected to go.

As most of the World has already said, we need a strong box to box midfielder. Maybe a change of formation (ala the Blunts 3-5-2) would help with Rice as part of a back three, Freddy and Arthur as wing backs, three from Anderson/Nobes/Lanzini/Fornals/Yarmo in midfield and Haller/Ajeti(?)/Big Mike(when fit fighting for the two spots up front.

We currently seem so wide open and susceptible to everything at the moment :(

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sendô
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by sendô » Mon Oct 28, 2019 4:53 pm

Haller isn't the problem.

He might not have the pace and skill that Arnie had, but he is a far more complete striker, his all round game is better and he brings other players into the game more. He arguably could improve on some of his timing and runs in the box, but ultimately the problem is one of support to him from other players, and not leaving him isolated up front.

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MooresTheHero
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by MooresTheHero » Mon Oct 28, 2019 4:59 pm

Agree Sendo, that's why I suggested a change of formation to help him out.

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Cuenca 'ammer
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Cuenca 'ammer » Mon Oct 28, 2019 5:01 pm

sendô wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 4:53 pm
Haller isn't the problem.

He might not have the pace and skill that Arnie had, but he is a far more complete striker, his all round game is better and he brings other players into the game more. He arguably could improve on some of his timing and runs in the box, but ultimately the problem is one of support to him from other players, and not leaving him isolated up front.
and therein the crux of the problem.

like I said somewhere else - Ronaldo and/or Messi could play here and not score.

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sendô
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by sendô » Mon Oct 28, 2019 5:23 pm

MooresTheHero wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 4:59 pm
Agree Sendo, that's why I suggested a change of formation to help him out.
To be honest, I think it's the "number 10" role that's the issue. As much as I like Lanzini, he's too much of a luxury player. He's no winger and so cannot play out wide, but you can't put him centre mid as he leaves you weak. We need 3 centre mids, if one is Rice and one is Noble then we need someone with the legs to run and an attacking instinct. Box to box as they call them.

Snodgrass did much better first half, but then Pellers moved him out wide, and then subbed him. :eh:

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Puff Daddy
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Puff Daddy » Mon Oct 28, 2019 5:41 pm

No

Crouchend_Hammer
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Crouchend_Hammer » Mon Oct 28, 2019 5:48 pm

sendô wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 5:23 pm
To be honest, I think it's the "number 10" role that's the issue. As much as I like Lanzini, he's too much of a luxury player. He's no winger and so cannot play out wide, but you can't put him centre mid as he leaves you weak. We need 3 centre mids, if one is Rice and one is Noble then we need someone with the legs to run and an attacking instinct. Box to box as they call them.

Snodgrass did much better first half, but then Pellers moved him out wide, and then subbed him. :eh:
One player who would make a huge difference to us is Wijnaldum, especially in the role he plays for Netherlands. Obviously we are not going to buy him, but he is just what we need

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Chicken Run Supreme
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Chicken Run Supreme » Mon Oct 28, 2019 6:14 pm

I thought it would be, but so far, I am under-chuffed.

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hammer1975
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by hammer1975 » Mon Oct 28, 2019 6:18 pm

This ‘team’ has better potential.

I would argue that it’s not better given the reduced options available to the coach.

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bubbles1966
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by bubbles1966 » Mon Oct 28, 2019 6:48 pm

The answer is no.

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e17
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by e17 » Mon Oct 28, 2019 7:04 pm

No is categorically the answer to the OP

Kialos
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Kialos » Tue Oct 29, 2019 12:37 am

funky chicken wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:56 pm
To put this pathetic excuse of Hernandez earned us points off the bench argument to bed, he only debatably did it TWICE last season.

1) West Ham 4-2 Burnley - which we may have won anyway as if you take his goal away it's still a 3-2 win;

2) West Ham 4-3 Huddersfield - unquestionably he earned us the 3 points as he got the all important goals to level us and win us the game.

So he arguably only earned us THREE measly points off the bench throughout the whole of last season.

Are we sure we are missing him? :?
If you think Hernandez was sold because he was not needed, more fool you, he was sold purely so Sullivan could cash in.

A goal is a goal it matters not whether he was starting or coming off the bench. If Haller gets injured or suspended he would have been be a more credible option than the striker we have on the bench right now. Expecting Ajeti to perform to the same level straight away as a player with the PL experience and PL goal scoring ability that Hernandez had is ridiculous.

He scored 7 PL goals last season, our third highest goal scorer after Arnautovic who has obviously left and Anderson. His goal ratio was the best at the club.

Debating whether his goals earned us X number of points is a mugs game. You will never know if a goal that was scored first led to a build up in momentum allowing other goals to be scored by other players. A goal scored last but not the goal that put us into the lead could have been the killer blow after the opposition were looking like they could equalise. Anyone who watches football knows this.

Selling Hernandez after the PL window was closed and after knowing Antonio was out long term was a stupid decision that benefited one person only. If the player wanted out he should have been sold before the window closed and replaced with a player of equal PL experience and ability or kept until January and then sold and replaced.

Kialos
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Re: Is our squad better this season?

Post by Kialos » Tue Oct 29, 2019 12:43 am

thejackhammer wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 3:34 pm

4. Perez, very harsh. Hernandez just never looked comfortable here, he always wanted to leave and I doubt he'd have seen anymore minutes than Ajeti has. We're also judging Ajeti on very little time.

What are you talking about, Hernandez has still played more PL minutes than Ajeti has this season and scored the goal in the 1-1 draw at Brighton!

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