Manager 18 - David Moyes: yes or no? [POLL]

[-DL-]

People aren’t really going to “booo” him are they? :lol:

****ing hell

Well it is panto season

Going to enjoy explaining that one to my little un on Wednesday...

[e17]

Oh yes you will! Oh no you won’t! Etcetera etcetera

Good first game DL, I predict we’re going to win by 4 or 5, no matter what comes after this game....

[Denzil]

I still can't believe David Moyes is our manager. Will he keep us up? He's got a chance, yes. I probably have more faith in him that Pellers to do so.

But the forward vision? Well there is none. He's not a manager to take us forward, he's not here for the long term, he is stemming the bleeding for now and in 18 months time we will be going through all of this again, on the hunt for a new manager.

The board have all of this to answer for. I am as disinterested as I have ever been about the club even before this. I didn't even bother going on Saturday, which given I have been working away for the last three months and was the first game I could attend is shocking. Will happily accept stick for it but I had rather just stay at home and left my seat empty. I am away for Bournemouth too and don't even care that I am missing it. I digress, I've been off the forum for a week or so and have so much to moan about I am doing it all in the wrong thread.

Back to the topic, no I don't support the hire. They have had time to think about his replacement, this has not come out of the blue, there are plenty of targets out there that we could have got in with the right money, the right vision and the right philosophy. This screams of desperation, being dictated to by a man deemed not good enough 18 months ago by us and seemingly every other club that has changed manager in that time as well. This is not a vendetta against Moyes, he’s had an opportunity for another crack at Premier League management when his career looked seemingly done on a permanent basis. Why would he not take it. This is purely down to the board, they’ve gone cheap, they’ve gone completely non-motivational, they’ve done more harm than good in the fan base, they’re going to make that stadium even more toxic and for all of those reasons this, on the face of it, is a terrible appointment. Now we as football fans are a fickle bunch and I really do hope that I eat my words and we tear the league alight, but being realistic the best we can hope for under David Moyes is avoiding relegation this season and finishing 12th next. I also believe that during that time, our young talent, the likes of Diop and Rice, will be very much open to a move away from the club and we could well see bids coming in for the pair of them during 2020. Why would young players want to stick around under a manager that the board are not even sure will be a long term appointment given they would only offer an 18 month contract. Herein lies the problem too. Even the board aren’t sure. You either bring in a caretaker manager, or you back someone. This couldn’t be more unconvincing if it tried. Are they really going to back a manager in any of the windows when they’re not even sure themselves that they will keep him?

I’d love to know if Mark Noble still believes that the club isn’t ran like a circus.

[Greatest Cockney Rip Off]

Yet we were in the bottom three when he took over.

The only reason we didn't go down that season was that there were marginally worse teams below us such as Swansea and Stoke (even though Swansea thumped us 4-1) and West Brom who were absolutely dire. We only won two more games than Stoke and drew the same amount of games as Swansea. Hardly inspiring.

The results showed they weren't interested?
We signed the season off with wins against Everton and Leicester and a credible draw with Man Utd the season they finished 2nd. If that's the players not interested I don't even want to know what they thought of Pellegrini.

Well, if losing 4-1 at Swansea City is showing "interest" I don't know what is. We had some shocking defeats under Moyes too and at times, he looked clueless in terms of tactics. Yes Pellegrini was awful and should have went sooner, but replacing him with Moyes to me, is replacing him with someone who is on a par.
I think if the board had have replaced MP earlier, we wouldn't have been in this situation. It was clear to everyone that his bizarre formations, his complete lack of exploiting opposition's weaknesses and his days spent on the golf course rather than concentrating on the job in hand (yeah, I do remember how everyone slated me for bringing that one up) then maybe we wouldn't be in this situation. Hardly "next level" appointing someone who wasn't worthy of a contract last time round.

[The Old Man of Storr]

We're not run like a Circus .

Running a Circus needs planning and getting the seating right .

[Humbug]

Win Rate %
Moyes 42.11% 6 clubs
Pellegrini 49.8% 6 clubs
Pochettino 45.7% 3 clubs
Niko Kovac 51.53% 4 clubs
Chris Hughton 40.6% 6 clubs
Tony Pulis 36.29% 7 clubs
Rafael Benitez 49.7% 13 clubs
Pep Guardiola 72.6% 3 clubs (Barcelona, Bayern Munich, Man City) - not bad when you have unlimited funds
Jose Mourinho 64.7% 9 clubs (seems to be consistently the best over many clubs) - had lots of money to spend
Jurgen Klopp 52.2% 3 clubs - had lots of money to spend.

Not much to choose from the first 7 in reality when you look at the stats. It's the quality and professional mentality of the squad of players that count more than anything that the manager does. These days if the money is there and they don't think it will be better elsewhere, they might give 100%. Long gone are the days when players loved playing football for the pleasure, pride for their club and fan adulation.

[Denzil]

Not denying Moyes was a decent manager earlier this decade and prior, be interested to see what those win rates look like since 2013

[brothernero]

Razzle Dazzle was the name of the speedboat driven by Hammond in the latest “ Grand Tour” special in Cambodia i wonder ?

Who is Hammond and what is the Grand Tour? Is he a potential buyer or something.

[Beavis Danzig]

Not denying Moyes was a decent manager earlier this decade and prior, be interested to see what those win rates look like since 2013

man united 50%
sociedad 29%
sunderland 19%
WHU 29%

[Denzil]

Cheers mate. So the Man United numbers are bulking up his win % stats. A league winning Man United side he took over.

[thejackhammer]

Cheers mate. So the Man United numbers are bulking up his win % stats. A league winning Man United side he took over.

Ferguson knew what he was doing. He bolted at the perfect time.
The Man United board also wouldn't let Moyes make the transfers he wanted. Fellaini had a release clause but they waited for it to expire and has to pay more, he also wanted Fabregas from Barcelona and Baines.
Fellaini went on to be important for a Mourinho led Man United, Mourinho remains the only manager to better Moyes' win percentage at Man United, and the rest spent a lot more.

[Humbug]

Cheers mate. So the Man United numbers are bulking up his win % stats. A league winning Man United side he took over.

The same stats bulking effect could be happening for many of those managers I listed (except possibly Pulis and Hughton). But it's obvious to me that its the quality of the players and their own motivating factors that determine their performance. If we delved deeply enough into every club they managed , we might find that some managers motivated 'non-star' squads better than others . But then you've also got to look at the standard and degree of 'difficulty/opposition' in each league too. Moyes has spent most of his footballing career managing in PL , imho the most competitive league in the world. So difficult to assess the quality and effectiveness of managers when getting into the 'nitty gritty' but its plain to see that managers who managed top teams had the better win rates

[WestHamIFC]

Ferguson knew what he was doing. He bolted at the perfect time.
The Man United board also wouldn't let Moyes make the transfers he wanted.

This. The subsequent failures of Van Gaal and Mourinho prove this point.

[Humbug]

Lose rate

Moyes 32% 6 clubs 919 games
Pellegrini 28% 6 clubs 719 games
Pochettino 31% 3 clubs 514 games
Niko Kovac 27% 4 clubs 229 games
Chris Hughton 32% 6 clubs 446 games
Tony Pulis 34% 7 clubs 1127 games
Rafael Benitez 26% 13 clubs 1127 games
Pep Guardiola 11% 3 clubs 654 games
Jose Mourinho 15% 9 clubs 919 games
Jurgen Klopp 23% 3 clubs 325 games

Again , not that much difference if you aren't managing a top club. Although Benitez looks pretty good at organising a defence over 1,127 games with 13 clubs.

[Ozza]

Cheers Humbug, how does Fat Sam stack up on that?

[Universidad-de-Chile]

Interessting will be also to compare Moyes´s ManU vs Pellers ManC ...

How much money had actually both to spend and what they got there..

To get the whole real picture... "overview"

[ImageLost]

Best Moyes gets a win over Gillingham and a good FA run

[Humbug]

Cheers Humbug, how does Fat Sam stack up on that?

Forgot about BFS

12 clubs, 1034 games , win rate 39.4%, lose rate 34%

PS. That includes managing England with his 100% win rate for 1 game

[Ironing Board]

Cheers mate. So the Man United numbers are bulking up his win % stats. A league winning Man United side he took over.

The flip side is League One Sunderland are dragging down his stats with a squad that managed to 'achieve' consecutive relegations! Having a billionaire owner who pulls the plug is clearly not an enjoyable experience - Chelsea better hope Abramovic doesn't throw in the towel

[Ironing Board]

Forgot about BFS

12 clubs, 1034 games , win rate 39.4%, lose rate 34%

PS. That includes managing England with his 100% win rate for 1 game

Perhaps a better gauge.

Sam's Premier League Record
Matches 512
Wins 174
Draws 138
Losses 200
Goals For 606
Goals Against 698
Win Percentage: 34%

Moyes Premier League Record
Matches 526
Wins 204
Draws 144
Losses 178
Goals For 690
Goals Against 657
Win Percentage: 38.8%