The January Transfer Window 2020

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hammer1975
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by hammer1975 » Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:41 pm

bubbles1966 wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:16 pm
Depends what they are aiming for.

At this stage midtable and a proper run for our money in the FA Cup ?
I’m not sure we’re not still in danger of relegation tbh. Even with the right players signed in January we’ve got some tough fixtures left and I think it’s going to be tight down there. If you then add in the risk of another injury to Fabianski, Antonio, or worse to Rice or Ogbonna and I think our chances of the drop could be much bigger. Even losing Fredericks (who I actually think has a terrible final ball) will have an adverse impact by missing 6 or 7 games - further reducing our pace options.

Finally fixing centre midfield with athleticism is the single biggest thing we could do to push us away from the danger zone imo. Would Allen alone do enough to fix that - I’m not sure, I think we could quickly align him to the static/slow West Ham midfield style and his Stoke relegation season form.

I actually think Moyes will make better decisions than Pellegrini to pull us away - but he needs options otherwise this could well be a short bounce.

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Morocco Mole
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Morocco Mole » Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:56 pm

Aceface wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 5:18 pm
Snodgrass also blitzed the Championship when he was down there.
Yup. Goals and assists for days. The assertion that Allen is ‘much better than Snodgrass’ is hugely debatable.

In fact it’s total b*llocks.

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Billydinho
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Billydinho » Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:58 pm

Joe Allen in, with Moyes at the helm.

World class team in a world class stadium.

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Morocco Mole
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Morocco Mole » Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:58 pm

Ironing Board wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 5:29 pm
“Joe Allen

“Prototype midfielder; active; consistent; able to control tempo and develop attacking moves.”

According to UEFA.....
So Mark Noble then.

We’ve already got one of him.

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Morocco Mole
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Morocco Mole » Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:03 pm

Ironing Board wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 5:36 pm
Obviously you have to take this with a massive helping of salt as it is Rodgers, but he previously said:

“I would have paid many millions more for this kid. He’s unique in that he’s a British player who is incredible on the ball.

“Joe’s role is to keep the ball. And that, in Britain, is a special talent. It is why Paul Scholes is still playing to his age. It is such a rare talent for a midfielder to rarely give the ball away.

“Where we have been really pleased with Joe is with his tactical discipline. Maybe he’s never going to score as many as Steven Gerrard but he’s certainly got quality going forward.

“Offensively, he has far more than what a lot of people have seen, just because he’s having to play a more sitting role at the moment.

“I have played him in there because he knows how to control the game. He is courageous and will go and get the ball in any area.

“It is his tactical discipline to stay and keep the shape of the team and offer the passing line, which has been really good though."
I heard him say all of that flowery waffle about Jonjo Shelvey - he even stroked his face like the creepy little weirdo he is - before promptly selling him to Newcastle 2 week’s later.

Good manager but chats breeze.

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bubbles1966
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by bubbles1966 » Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:03 pm

hammer1975 wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:41 pm
I’m not sure we’re not still in danger of relegation tbh. Even with the right players signed in January we’ve got some tough fixtures left and I think it’s going to be tight down there. If you then add in the risk of another injury to Fabianski, Antonio, or worse to Rice or Ogbonna and I think our chances of the drop could be much bigger. Even losing Fredericks (who I actually think has a terrible final ball) will have an adverse impact by missing 6 or 7 games - further reducing our pace options.

Finally fixing centre midfield with athleticism is the single biggest thing we could do to push us away from the danger zone imo. Would Allen alone do enough to fix that - I’m not sure, I think we could quickly align him to the static/slow West Ham midfield style and his Stoke relegation season form.

I actually think Moyes will make better decisions than Pellegrini to pull us away - but he needs options otherwise this could well be a short bounce.
I agree, and I think the decision to test out a back 3 in just the second game is a recognition of our weaknesses and ways to compensate by sticking an extra 6'2-6'5 CB on the pitch and shuffling masuaku into something vaguely like a midfield/LW area to add some sprightliness etc.

I'm not a great fan of Randolph or Allen - but they are improvements on Bob, Sanchez and Wilshere - either via quality or fitness.

A back 3 probably gives some more insurance for Winston if he plays - Cresswell can double up with Arfur, a lightweight midfield should have some big, assertive CB players behind them etc...

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Billydinho
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Billydinho » Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:04 pm

I cant believe how comfortable everyone is at the prospect of signing Joe Allen.

You deserve these owners.

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hammer1975
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by hammer1975 » Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:19 pm

bubbles1966 wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:03 pm
but they are improvements on Bob, Sanchez and Wilshere - either via quality or fitness.
Whilst I don’t disagree doesn’t that statement highlight how low a bar it is and how poor our recruitment has been!

We’ve got to break the cycle in centre midfield, Allen doesn’t do that for me. I bet we sign him.

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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Crouchend_Hammer » Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:29 pm

As TTS pointed out, as well as needing to improve the first team, we also need to improve the quality of the squad, especially in midfield.
Noble, Allen, Snodgrass - probably not that much to choose between them all in terms of overall quality/ ability etc. The point is that if we want to maintain a cup run and ensure we move up the table in the Premier League we need to be able to rotate/ rest players a bit. That also means having substitutes to bring on for the last 20 mins to give players a breather without drastically downgrading the quality.
Joe Allen is cetainly a bit of a 'meh' signing but we need numbers in our squad and he has experience of the league so we know he won't need time to adjuay/ bed-in

Pheonix32 was also correct when he said that the January window is a very reactive one for most clubs. Most signings are made to fulfill a short term objective/ plug a gap and thus in an ideal world you would not need to buy in January and save cash for summer window when more players are available and you can plan a bit more

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bubbles1966
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by bubbles1966 » Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:29 pm

Billydinho wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:04 pm
I cant believe how comfortable everyone is at the prospect of signing Joe Allen.

You deserve these owners.
Give up your season ticket if you have one.

Don't give them anything in advance. Not a penny. Make them work for you.

If they make you angry and you think they're pisstakers, don't ever give them cash upfront on the basis of a nudge and a wink.

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Albie Beck
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Albie Beck » Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:35 pm

bubbles1966 wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:29 pm

Give up your season ticket if you have one.

Don't give them anything in advance. Not a penny. Make them work for you.
Doesn't work, bubbs. Pissing in the wind.

They make far, far more from TV and commercial income than all the season tickets, so they can pay themselves exorbitant interest. We are just wallpaper and don't dent their pocket at all.

We can embarrass them, though. That's the only way you can get at them.

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hammer1975
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by hammer1975 » Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:37 pm

Crouchend_Hammer wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:29 pm
Pheonix32 was also correct when he said that the January window is a very reactive one for most clubs. Most signings are made to fulfill a short term objective/ plug a gap and thus in an ideal world you would not need to buy in January and save cash for summer window when more players are available and you can plan a bit more
We obviously get to hear this every January but is it actually true? Has anyone ever done any real analysis to back the statement up? Liverpool bought Van Dijk in January - arguably the catalyst for their world domination. Arsenal bought Aubemyang - comfortably their best player. Spurs bought Lucas - who won them a CL semi final. Once upon a time we bought Dean Ashton - who propelled us to an FA cup final that we were minutes from winning. Bad scoutIng is bad scouting, good scouting is good scouting...?

Is it a bit like the phrase ‘bad workman blames his tools’ - which is a phrase that has it’s roots in being trotted out by middle management to keep costs down by embarrassing the workers into working with what they had rather than asking for new tools.

Crouchend_Hammer
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Crouchend_Hammer » Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:43 pm

There are obviously exceptions if you are a top club with £50m to spend and the lure of Champions League and trophies

However, most clubs use the Jan window as a sticky plaster to help achieve a short term objective

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Johnny Byrne's Boots
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Johnny Byrne's Boots » Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:44 pm

In other news

Nicolò Schira @NicoSchira

#Chelsea are interested in Wilfried #Zaha. Talks ongoing with #CrystalPalace that asked €80M to sell him. Marina Granovskaia is working to lower the price and could offer Michy #Batshuayi as counterpart. #transfers #CFC

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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Gsbgsb » Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:47 pm

Whatever system we play I struggle to see our first choice central midfield being anything other than Rice and Noble until the end of the season. Moyes has high regard for both.

Problem is if anything were to happen to either of them there is no-one to replace them. Wilshere is injured, Sanchez is poor and Snodgrass, Fornals etc are all more suited to a wider or more advanced role - where we are reasonably well stocked at present (Lanzini, Fornals, Anderson, Snodgrass, Yarmolenko and Antonio). I suspect whoever we might get in Moyes has to be satisfied that player can cover at least one of the central roles.

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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Mikloskosglovebag » Tue Jan 07, 2020 12:20 am

Randolph and Allen would both be great additions to the squad. Doubt there is going to be a big upheaval in this window.

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Ironing Board
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Ironing Board » Tue Jan 07, 2020 12:30 am

Romford_Iron wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 8:28 pm
Yeah let’s replace a 32 year old with a (soon to be) 30 year old :?

Just like Shelvey, Allen isn’t going to be good enough in the long run. We’ll be looking to improve on him very, very soon so it’s a waste of money. The only way I’d consider signing Allen, is if we can sign another quality midfielder. But even then, it’s incredibly short sighted.

The real answer would be to sign Fernandes and Berge, but we all know the owners aren’t going to do that.
You can’t even compare Shelvey and Allen, as they are completely different. Allen is consistent and metronomic with a good eye for a pass. Shelvey is wildly inconsistent, capable of looking amazing one game and awful the next.

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Ironing Board
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Ironing Board » Tue Jan 07, 2020 12:31 am

Morocco Mole wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:58 pm
So Mark Noble then.

We’ve already got one of him.
Yeah, and then we look like a bag of s*** whenever he gets injured!

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Ironing Board
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Ironing Board » Tue Jan 07, 2020 12:35 am

e17 wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:04 pm
Nah. Diego was better than Messi.

Ask Napoli fans. Or Argentinians for that matter.
I don’t actually think he was. He certainly did not have the sustained brilliance of Messi. Messi is at least on a level with Maradona.

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Lil Joe 17
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Re: The January Transfer Window 2020

Post by Lil Joe 17 » Tue Jan 07, 2020 12:38 am

Are we going to hear this overwhelming negativity with every signing that isn't 40m or higher? :thdn:

Allen isn't the answer to all of our problems, but he is an an answer to one of our problems. Same with Randolph.

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