A vote of confidence [POLL]

[e-20]

I would describe the feeling as some sort of fleeting reminder of a stronger emotion I once felt in the past.

Like Marcel Proust and the Madeleine. It brings me back to memories past, but it’s not the same.

Me too if I could rid myself of this bond I would. But sadly my great grandfather was a shipwright at TI my grandfather was plucked out of the Thames during the Albion disaster, my family have followed the club ever since it started, I am privileged to have started supporting early 60s, saw first hand most of the Cup Finals, was privileged to see the greats at their best, experience the humour from the chicken run that made enjoyment well beyond the match itself, the ups and downs yes but nearly always entertaining at least up to the 80s when things began to sour for me as meciocrity started to become the norm. A few naive hopes for change since but nothing has depressed me more than the self serving sociopaths in charge now. All that remains for me now is a cord to that past I can't break and memories, nothing but pain otherwise in recent years because even the odd highlight just inevitably feels like a prelude to further decline and struggles and the understanding that the total lack of professionalism, the incompetence the absense of any semblance of self awareness and the self serving at the top will inevitably lead to this state of affairs continuing.

[Doc H Ball]

The last few posts make for good reading.

The ironic thing is that if they actually gave a couple of the people running the protest jobs in place of a couple of others they currently employ, we would all be better off.

[DaveWHU1964]

But, when you see us play well, for instance like we did against Chelsea earlier this season, even if it is highlights on MotD or whatever, doesn't that sense of pride still flow through you?

Not for me Proph. I feel disconnected from something that I thought would ALWAYS be a huge part of my life. I honestly feel like an outsider looking in.

[prophet:marginal]

So, Dave, in the spirit of discussion, what is it that makes you continue to post about the team on here? I am NOT criticising this, I hope you appreciate, because it may be that I am simply using a word (pride/proud) that people interpret in different ways, but there must be some kind of feeling that is still positive about following/supporting the team?

[DaveWHU1964]

So, Dave, in the spirit of discussion, what is it that makes you continue to post about the team on here? I am NOT criticising this, ...

I know you're not Proph - you're one of the good guys.

To answer your question I still post on here because despite not considering what we currently have to be in any way, shape or form the West Ham I remember and recognise I haven't given up in believing we can get some of it back. Much has gone. Much can't be got back. But there is still stuff that can be salvaged. Trouble is the longer the parasites remain the less there will be to salvage.

So no, I have no pride in the team, no care for its results. I see merits in relegation, the chance that it would bring for change (please anyone intending to say there's less chance of them going in we go down - I've heard it all before and I don't believe it for a moment. So without being able to bring myself to actively wanting us to be relegated I don't care if it happens because good things could just come from it. I take no pleasure in writing that by the way.

But just to be clear I do have massive pride in West Ham, just not today's version. A version pretty much hated, and sadly rightly so, by so many fans of other clubs because of the spivvy, classless, grasping, root-less West Ham our current owners have created in their own image.

I reserve my pride for mates who like me have been to four figures worth of games over the decades but who will never step in that place again until the scum have gone. I have pride and huge respect for those lads and lasses who gathered before the game to say enough is enough and that we are better than this because we always were and we can be again. That's the pride that remains for me Proph - I truly hope that one day I have pride in the team again. I want to be able to care about it again. That won't be just yet but I really, really hope it happens bud.

[Samba]

Can I suggest Gonorrhea as an alternative?

Only if it's the 'world's worst' super-gonorrhoea..

[Ozza]

Dave that sums it up for me perfectly for me, bang on usual mate

[prophet:marginal]

Dave that sums it up for me perfectly for me, bang on usual mate

I can readily understand you, even if I differ ever so slightly. I still feel pride when watching the better moments of team play, even to this date.

I do however agree with the sentiment that in part I am only sticking with it because of some hope for the future - in the sense that it may get better if things change at board level.

I am however one of life's pessimists; I sadly think that, irrespective of the personalities of the owners, the game itself has lost a lot of its charm. We may be in for a long old wait!

[BondsoBob]

I think that although GSB have exasperated all the problems that are West Ham, especially with the move to the OS. It is a malaise and decline that has been going on for many, many years. It constantly amazes me that there are still so many WHU fans around when you consider that we haven't won a proper trophy for 40 years, and all the crap that goes with it now days.
I started to get disillusioned with it all sometime in the mid 90's, just after the Bonds debacle. Something just clicked in me that said things were never going to get any better and probably only going to get worse (which they have).

[Faithless]

I can readily understand you, even if I differ ever so slightly. I still feel pride when watching the better moments of team play, even to this date.

I do however agree with the sentiment that in part I am only sticking with it because of some hope for the future - in the sense that it may get better if things change at board level.

I am however one of life's pessimists; I sadly think that, irrespective of the personalities of the owners, the game itself has lost a lot of its charm. We may be in for a long old wait!

I tend to agree with you. Commercialism, professionalism and capitalism all combine to remove the charm from every sport (and other entertainment industries) they get their claws into.

[DaveWHU1964]

I can readily understand you, even if I differ ever so slightly.

I think this is the thing - the likes of you and me don't disagree much on this stuff.

I still feel pride when watching the better moments of team play, even to this date.

I wonder if that will last and if so for how long Proph. I'm sure that for many, perhaps including yourself, that feeling will last a lifetime. For others, again perhaps including yourself, it won't. What the last few years have shown me is something I simply wouldn't have considered possible - that when it comes to supporting West Ham I had a tipping point, well two actually - them giving club money to the Tories and then how the march was scuppered before the Burnley game. Double whammy - it did for me on the care about results and pride in the team fronts. 1,000s upon 1,000s of us have found their own tipping point.

I do however agree with the sentiment that in part I am only sticking with it because of some hope for the future - in the sense that it may get better if things change at board level.

My hope.

I am however one of life's pessimists; I sadly think that, irrespective of the personalities of the owners, the game itself has lost a lot of its charm. We may be in for a long old wait!

And you are undoubtedly right re: the game. The game has lost much of its charm. But we as a club had more charm and magic about us than the average club and our owners have shown more blaise disregard for it and even more greed than the average PL board has. Football has changed. Other clubs have changed. But we have changed far more than the average club and perhaps more than any other club in the league has. If other clubs moved they at least moved to proper football grounds and with the exception of Arsenal didn't begin the process of deliberately changing the make up of their club's fans.

As for pessimism I don't blame you Proph. However I feel that (and this most definitely isn't aimed at you) that the general feeling of defeatism, pessimism, being resigned to, or accepting our lot that you see so often amongst fans actively assists the scum to further erode our club and the remaining hopes of its fans, and whilst we were a smallish club from an unfashionable and poor part of town, we were ALWAYS about hoping and dreaming. People coming to terms with the unemployable-except-by-us Moyes and putting up arguments for Joe ****ing Allen is imho as likely to show a breaking of many fans' spirit as it is to show the ever necessary pragmatism needed to cope with yet another groundhog season at West Ham.

[brothernero]

Bit surprised that this poll has kind of come to and end in terms of votes.

Thought it might even reach the 1000+ mark.

Nevertheless it's still pretty damning with the No's being 96%

[Aceface]

The game has lost much of its charm. But we as a club had more charm and magic about us than the average club and our owners have shown more blaise disregard for it and even more greed than the average PL board has. Football has changed. Other clubs have changed. But we have changed far more than the average club and perhaps more than any other club in the league has. If other clubs moved they at least moved to proper football grounds and with the exception of Arsenal didn't begin the process of deliberately changing the make up of their club's fans.

As for pessimism I don't blame you Proph. However I feel that (and this most definitely isn't aimed at you) that the general feeling of defeatism, pessimism, being resigned to, or accepting our lot that you see so often amongst fans actively assists the scum to further erode our club and the remaining hopes of its fans, and whilst we were a smallish club from an unfashionable and poor part of town, we were ALWAYS about hoping and dreaming. People coming to terms with the unemployable-except-by-us Moyes and putting up arguments for Joe ****ing Allen is imho as likely to show a breaking of many fans' spirit as it is to show the ever necessary pragmatism needed to cope with yet another groundhog season at West Ham.

Two great paragraphs there Dave. The last part in particular gets at a grey area that I think a lot of people struggle with – a sense that to criticise any signing or manager is to be unfair to them personally, or is somehow undermining the team. It's a conundrum that gets to the very nature of fandom – is being a good supporter backing the club/player/manager regardless? I can see and understand the emotional pull of that argument. But you can hope David Moyes succeeds while simultaneously holding the view that the thinking and process for appointing him was pathetic. That 'get in behind them' spirit can be self-defeating in the long run since it's to the advantage of the lazy stewards we have.