I absolutely hope so. I've been wanting that all season. Play Fornals and Lanzini/new player in the CM and have Benny, Bowen, new LW on the wings.
Makes a huge difference, especially against the smaller teams who try to 'play'.
Moderator: Gnome
I absolutely hope so. I've been wanting that all season. Play Fornals and Lanzini/new player in the CM and have Benny, Bowen, new LW on the wings.
MB had it spot on a few weeks ago... we seem to often focus on what a player doesn't bring rather than does bring for some players when it is convenient; Soucek, Benrahma, Fornals, Lanzini, Antonio all get hit with this.Diogenes wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 11:48 am I agree with that. Some seem to want to put each player under a microscope and dissect each individual flaw and/or attribute. What we tend to forget is, it is not about 'each' individual but the team as a 'whole' where we (West Ham) are strongest. Soucek is very much a big part of that and when we consider any new additions it will be as much about 'fitting in' and temperament etc. than just individual talent.
Yeah it's probably the right call.ironilunga wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 11:55 am We don’t need to upgrade Soucek, we need to bring in a player of better or comparable quality to share the load with him and Rice.
Declan Rice is a world class defensive midfielder. Soucek plays the more offensive role in the partnership better than Rice. Soucek’s goal tally halved this year due to a more restrained role. This is one of the issues that impacted our final points tally imo.
I'd argue that every signing we make from now on should be a ball player. There's no reason why a ball player can't also have other attributes. Players shouldn't be bought purely on physical traits. First and foremost, they should be a footballer. This is the type of approach that Brighton have taken and they are very very close to being a side qualifying for Europe. They'll be competing for our spot next season. Every player in the team should be fully capable of linking up fluently when we have the ball and we go forward. If we want to progress and we want to move forward then we need to try and move on from being the team that works hard out of possession and counter attacks. Other teams have learnt how to counter what we do. We have a fairly small selection of passages of play that we try and do over and over again. It's become incredibly predictable to watch. We need to start varying it and we need players that are capable of doing this. That means shaking things up a bit and may also mean making some unpopular decisions.Liam wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 11:54 am I wonder if the rotation that Moyes made against Norwich was an indication of how he wants to play against the smaller teams (those that we dropped loads of points against this season). Putting a ball player alongside Rice.
If Moyes wants to do that against bigger teams he will need more trust in all other positions, CB, Fullbacks and wingers.
Or we sign someone who doesn't do everything Soucek can do but is simply better at football and so makes us better.westlondonhammer wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 12:00 pm MB had it spot on a few weeks ago... we seem to often focus on what a player doesn't bring rather than does bring for some players when it is convenient; Soucek, Benrahma, Fornals, Lanzini, Antonio all get hit with this.
If someone who can name a player who does everything Soucek can do but is also a more expansive passer than great... I'm not sure I know one. McTominy certainly isn't.
So you'll lose something by replacing him in the middle of the park. So allow him to do what he does great and then play a simple pass to someone who is a better passer of the ball.
Saying that, we do need quality alternatives to enable him (and Rice), the ability to rest every now and then
Declan Rice is an infinitely better footballer than Tomas Soucek. We should not be limiting a world-class footballer just because it means Soucek can score a few more headers and tap-ins over the course of a season.ironilunga wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 12:03 pm Declan Rice is a world class defensive midfielder. Soucek plays the more offensive role in the partnership better than Rice. Soucek’s goal tally halved this year due to a more restrained role. This is one of the issues that impacted our final points tally imo.
Its a lot of fun for a lot of folk.sussexhammer74 wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 12:04 pm What is the record for the number of posts on a transfer thread?
I reckon this thread might smash that record.
Soucek has a nack of getting in the box. But Rice is far better offensively in respect of creativity and moving forward.ironilunga wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 12:03 pm Declan Rice is a world class defensive midfielder. Soucek plays the more offensive role in the partnership better than Rice. Soucek’s goal tally halved this year due to a more restrained role. This is one of the issues that impacted our final points tally imo.
It's just silly. We won't be selling guaranteed first teamers this summer. And beyond a starting eleven we only have five other players with any type of first team experience for us who will still be here if contracts aren't renewed for the couple of important players we have where they are expiring (Ogbonna, Fabianski).steveyrockstar wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 11:02 am It worries me that on top of the departing players we need to replace and squad holes we need to fill, we're all potentially looking to replace some first-teamers like Soucek.
McTominay is much better in possession than Soucek who is extremely limited on the ball.westlondonhammer wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 12:00 pm MB had it spot on a few weeks ago... we seem to often focus on what a player doesn't bring rather than does bring for some players when it is convenient; Soucek, Benrahma, Fornals, Lanzini, Antonio all get hit with this.
If someone who can name a player who does everything Soucek can do but is also a more expansive passer than great... I'm not sure I know one. McTominy certainly isn't.
So you'll lose something by replacing him in the middle of the park. So allow him to do what he does great and then play a simple pass to someone who is a better passer of the ball.
Saying that, we do need quality alternatives to enable him (and Rice), the ability to rest every now and then
If by offensive role you mean popping up in the box to score then yes, I agree. And he still does that - his shots per game have dropped a little (but not as much as a half) but he's still had a considerable amount of scoring opportunities this season. Pretty sure it averages at around 1.3 per game which is the 4th highest in the squad. The fact he's had less may have more to do with the fact we've looked tired since Christmas and have under-performed in the league.ironilunga wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 12:03 pm Declan Rice is a world class defensive midfielder. Soucek plays the more offensive role in the partnership better than Rice. Soucek’s goal tally halved this year due to a more restrained role. This is one of the issues that impacted our final points tally imo.
Ah yes, the famed Declan Rice creativity which sees him make 0.1 more key passes per game than Tomas Soucek, a lumbering oaf.El brooko79 wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 12:09 pm Soucek has a nack of getting in the box. But Rice is far better offensively in respect of creativity and moving forward.
Soucek is a DM and isn't good enough to play further forward imo. His goals from open play are what 5 a season and a bonus for us.
... at one aspect of the game.Aztec Hammer wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 12:04 pm Or we sign someone who doesn't do everything Soucek can do but is simply better at football and so makes us better...
If it’s not broken don’t fix it - add to it.Aztec Hammer wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 12:07 pm There is a valid line of thinking that we now need to progress away from a style of play that requires Soucek into a more fluid footballing one if we really want to compete for the Top 4 and Top 6.
4. Prevent the full-backs from crossing the ball.bubbles1966 wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 12:10 pm McTominay is much better in possession than Soucek who is extremely limited on the ball.
People keep asking how we have been worked out - well, there are some very obvious things to do against us
1 Keep the ball away from those who can pass it (Lanzini, Rice) and force it towards those who can't (Soucek is the #1 candidate, followed by Dawson)
2. Force it towards those who will panic and can't pick a pass under pressure - same two + fabianski
3. Tell your right hand side player just to stand in front or slightly outside of Cresswell's position - he has no right foot, cannot dribble, has no pace and will pass the ball backwards and infield all game.
And that’s where we need to be very careful…. We moved Soucek to accommodate Rice’s wish to be “ box to box” while still better as a defensive than offensive player, and reduced Souceks effectiveness as a result. If Rice goes, as most likely next summer, we’ll look a bit silly if we’ve already lost Soucek and are back to scratch. Ideally we need a 3rd cm of similar quality who all understand there’ll be rotation, occasionally we play all 3, but no one of them can dictate to the others or the club. Love Rice to bits but allowing him to decide where he plays to the detriment of others is a dangerous game when he won’t sign a new deal. We need 3 first choice cm’s with an adequate 4th as back up, 64 games this season still equates to 40 each for 3 players, and that ignoring substitutions.