Declan Rice
Moderators: Gnome, last.caress, Wilko1304, Rio, bristolhammerfc, the pink palermo, chalks
- westham,eggyandchips
- Posts: 25271
- Joined: Tue Aug 07, 2007 8:06 pm
- Location: On the tour bus
- Has liked: 2013 likes
- Total likes: 1496 likes
Re: Declan Rice
You know it's international break when there's a whole page dedicated to the correct use of a word. :lol:
-
- Posts: 15961
- Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:01 pm
- Has liked: 24 likes
- Total likes: 749 likes
-
- Posts: 9590
- Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2016 4:03 pm
- Has liked: 383 likes
- Total likes: 1414 likes
Re: Declan Rice
I actually thought Southgate made the same error as Moyes recently by not restricting Rice to the thing he's world class at and have him as a holding central midfielder that picks the ball up from the CBs and distributes it on.hammerman11 wrote: ↑Sat Sep 24, 2022 12:11 pm Rice is restricted by Southgate but he still played well last night
I see Rice as someone, currently, who is playing without a real role - a jack of all trades central midfielder. He's not especially box-to-box, not a deep playmaker, and not a defensive midfielder. That's not on him, that's on tactics, but at both club and international level he's just sat in a weird grey area where he doesn't really do anything specific. He's good enough that he does everything well, so he still looks good most of the time, but he's not really got a specific role for either club or country currently and it's weird.
- Colours never run
- Posts: 25386
- Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 1:46 am
- Location: "Be in no doubt, we are part of the most successful stadium migration in history"
- Has liked: 6762 likes
- Total likes: 2354 likes
Re: Declan Rice
I agree with a lot of that, apart from him not being a Defensive Midfielder.
He currently thinks he's better than he is in the Team. I was prepared to give him the benefit of doubt to see if he could seamlessly play further forward more often if he could score and assist goals and he doesn't look close to doing that. And when it comes at the expense of some of his defensive midfield duties, I think he can't justify it.
Now I say this as an old Defensive Midfield role advocate of his when he first played there for us instead of just Centre Half bur he could back it up straight away producing consistent quality.
It's now 1 of 2 things I want to see happen, either he sticks to doing what he does best at, or he rapidly starts producing it regularly further forward creating chances and scoring goals. I want to see discipline and control back in his game.its not quite there at the minute.
He currently thinks he's better than he is in the Team. I was prepared to give him the benefit of doubt to see if he could seamlessly play further forward more often if he could score and assist goals and he doesn't look close to doing that. And when it comes at the expense of some of his defensive midfield duties, I think he can't justify it.
Now I say this as an old Defensive Midfield role advocate of his when he first played there for us instead of just Centre Half bur he could back it up straight away producing consistent quality.
It's now 1 of 2 things I want to see happen, either he sticks to doing what he does best at, or he rapidly starts producing it regularly further forward creating chances and scoring goals. I want to see discipline and control back in his game.its not quite there at the minute.
Last edited by Colours never run on Mon Sep 26, 2022 8:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
-
- Posts: 26527
- Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2004 9:31 am
- Location: Forest Gate
- Has liked: 144 likes
- Total likes: 2399 likes
Re: Declan Rice
Always amazes me that people just come up with nonsense without any knowledge of the player in questionColours never run wrote: ↑Mon Sep 26, 2022 8:33 am He currently thinks he's better than he is in the Team. I was prepared to give him the benefit of doubt to see if he could seamlessly play further forward more often if he could score and assist goals and he doesn't look close to doing that. And when it comes at the expense of some of his defensive midfield duties, I think he can't justify it.
It's now 1 of 2 things I want to see happen, either he sticks to doing what he does best at, or he rapidly starts producing it regularly further forward creating chances and scoring goals. I want to see discipline and control back in his game.its not quite there at the minute.
"He currently thinks he is better than he is in the Team" - righto. Where on earth have you got this from?
Think he is playing crap. Fair enough. but any accusations based on his attitude, commitment, motivation etc are baseless
There are many central midfielders who do not have final assists and goals next to their name but that doesn't mean they are not integral to how their team attacks. You don't get assists for starting off a move, or breaking the lines, or running with the ball to turn defence into qttack, or spreading the play with a 60 yard pass - all things Rice does multiple times a game
- Colours never run
- Posts: 25386
- Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 1:46 am
- Location: "Be in no doubt, we are part of the most successful stadium migration in history"
- Has liked: 6762 likes
- Total likes: 2354 likes
Re: Declan Rice
You've made a hell of a leap there! Not sure where you're coming from based on what I said.
I haven't questioned his attitude at all, just that I don't think playing box to box suits him. Everything else about his game though screams Defensive Midfielder.
You say no knowledge and yet I called his progress early every step of the way and it's evident from the start of this very thread, onwards.
I haven't questioned his attitude at all, just that I don't think playing box to box suits him. Everything else about his game though screams Defensive Midfielder.
You say no knowledge and yet I called his progress early every step of the way and it's evident from the start of this very thread, onwards.
- S-H
- Posts: 49130
- Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2010 7:05 am
- Location: Kumb Inn
- Has liked: 5736 likes
- Total likes: 9652 likes
Re: Declan Rice
Nah, just KUMB..westham,eggyandchips wrote: ↑Mon Sep 26, 2022 7:00 am You know it's international break when there's a whole page dedicated to the correct use of a word. :lol:
-
- Posts: 26527
- Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2004 9:31 am
- Location: Forest Gate
- Has liked: 144 likes
- Total likes: 2399 likes
Re: Declan Rice
"He currently thinks he's better than he is in the Team."Colours never run wrote: ↑Mon Sep 26, 2022 8:50 am You've made a hell of a leap there! Not sure where you're coming from based on what I said.
I haven't questioned his attitude at all, just that I don't think playing box to box suits him. Everything else about his game though screams Defensive Midfielder.
You say no knowledge and yet I called his progress early every step of the way and it's evident from the start of this very thread, onwards.
How do you know what he thinks? Surely this is questioning his attitude??
-
- Posts: 15961
- Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:01 pm
- Has liked: 24 likes
- Total likes: 749 likes
Re: Declan Rice
ONE THING RICE DOES NEED TO DO IS IMPROVE HIS SHOOTING AS ITS AWFUL. HES HAD A FEW CHANCES THIS SEASON WHICH HE HAS BALLOONED OVER THE BAR.
- Colours never run
- Posts: 25386
- Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 1:46 am
- Location: "Be in no doubt, we are part of the most successful stadium migration in history"
- Has liked: 6762 likes
- Total likes: 2354 likes
Re: Declan Rice
Not at all. Players can think they're honestly better than they are without it being an attitude problem and I certainly don't think that of Rice. Bur I do think he's capable of doing more than what he thinks he can and it's on the manager to identify that and tell him it's just not quite working for both his own game as well as for the Team structure. I believe the manager has given his blessing to try it though so no issue there.Crouchend_Hammer wrote: ↑Mon Sep 26, 2022 9:09 am "He currently thinks he's better than he is in the Team."
How do you know what he thinks? Surely this is questioning his attitude??
And it doesn't mean he can never go forward when the right time in the game arises but it needs to be targeted when we have a real foothold in the game and few and far between. More than 90% I'd say of his game needs to be devoted to the Defensive Midfield role, doing what he does best. Box to box, then we start to lose some of that excellent work Defensively.
- S-H
- Posts: 49130
- Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2010 7:05 am
- Location: Kumb Inn
- Has liked: 5736 likes
- Total likes: 9652 likes
Re: Declan Rice
Spot on.Crouchend_Hammer wrote: ↑Mon Sep 26, 2022 8:45 am Always amazes me that people just come up with nonsense without any knowledge of the player in question
"He currently thinks he is better than he is in the Team" - righto. Where on earth have you got this from?
Think he is playing crap. Fair enough. but any accusations based on his attitude, commitment, motivation etc are baseless
There are many central midfielders who do not have final assists and goals next to their name but that doesn't mean they are not integral to how their team attacks. You don't get assists for starting off a move, or breaking the lines, or running with the ball to turn defence into qttack, or spreading the play with a 60 yard pass - all things Rice does multiple times a game
- Vic_Watson
- Posts: 8033
- Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 12:25 pm
- Location: Brazil
- Has liked: 166 likes
- Total likes: 259 likes
Re: Declan Rice
But we constantly are told he is one of the best in training at shootinghammerman11 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 26, 2022 9:10 am ONE THING RICE DOES NEED TO DO IS IMPROVE HIS SHOOTING AS ITS AWFUL. HES HAD A FEW CHANCES THIS SEASON WHICH HE HAS BALLOONED OVER THE BAR.
- -DL-
- Bag Man
- Posts: 30097
- Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2008 7:43 am
- Has liked: 834 likes
- Total likes: 4920 likes
- Contact:
- MB
- Cricket's Darren Anderton
- Posts: 25262
- Joined: Wed Dec 18, 2002 5:13 pm
- Has liked: 5672 likes
- Total likes: 3089 likes
Re: Declan Rice
Think you are going a bit far the other way there mate. Carrying the ball, yes. The rest multiple times a game? Really?Crouchend_Hammer wrote: ↑Mon Sep 26, 2022 8:45 am There are many central midfielders who do not have final assists and goals next to their name but that doesn't mean they are not integral to how their team attacks. You don't get assists for starting off a move, or breaking the lines, or running with the ball to turn defence into qttack, or spreading the play with a 60 yard pass - all things Rice does multiple times a game
He also has a bad habit of carrying the ball too far (tbf probably as much about the lack of movement around him as his own inability to see the final pass).
For me his best work is done deep and everything else is a sticky plaster for tactical deficiencies given our lack of ball carrying ability elsewhere in the side.
- BondsoBob
- Posts: 6992
- Joined: Tue Apr 04, 2006 12:05 pm
- Location: Folkestone, Kent,
- Has liked: 583 likes
- Total likes: 530 likes
Re: Declan Rice
Why are you shouting? As it happens I agree with you.hammerman11 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 26, 2022 9:10 am ONE THING RICE DOES NEED TO DO IS IMPROVE HIS SHOOTING AS ITS AWFUL. HES HAD A FEW CHANCES THIS SEASON WHICH HE HAS BALLOONED OVER THE BAR.
- Vic_Watson
- Posts: 8033
- Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 12:25 pm
- Location: Brazil
- Has liked: 166 likes
- Total likes: 259 likes
- Colours never run
- Posts: 25386
- Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 1:46 am
- Location: "Be in no doubt, we are part of the most successful stadium migration in history"
- Has liked: 6762 likes
- Total likes: 2354 likes
Re: Declan Rice
Knew I wasn't going mad, found the statement he recently made about how he sees his game now and that's why I raised the point, I don't think he is as good at that role as he thinks he is:Crouchend_Hammer wrote: ↑Mon Sep 26, 2022 8:45 am Always amazes me that people just come up with nonsense without any knowledge of the player in question
"He currently thinks he is better than he is in the Team" - righto. Where on earth have you got this from?
Think he is playing crap. Fair enough. but any accusations based on his attitude, commitment, motivation etc are baseless
There are many central midfielders who do not have final assists and goals next to their name but that doesn't mean they are not integral to how their team attacks. You don't get assists for starting off a move, or breaking the lines, or running with the ball to turn defence into qttack, or spreading the play with a 60 yard pass - all things Rice does multiple times a game
"I am not just a holding midfielder any more. I was always labelled as one that just sits in front of the back four, I really now want to see myself as a box-to-box player where I can get up and down and create things as well".
Now if he's to be considered a quality Box to Box Centre Midfielder, for me he has to regularly contribute with assists and goals when he finds himself in those areas when he goes flying forward. A great ball carrier, that's not disputed but it's that final third end product I want to see him do more of to justify him haring forward so often. But as it stands since he's been given more licence to do so, he's struggled in 9 games for us this season to score in any, often shooting woefully in to the stands giving possession up easily. On top of that I don't see him creating decent chances often, let alone assist. That end product side of his game in the final third is lacking and I'm struggling to justify him doing that role when the Team has also played so poorly in general with a real lack of points on the board to boot.
Ironically, shouldn't he return to predominantly playing as a quality Defensive Midfielder with the pressure both off him and the Team to produce decent performances and results, I think the goals when he does end up further forward on the odd occasion will return again. But as its stands, he's snatching too many chances and isn't creating much which compounds the issue. I'd prefer him to get back to what he excels at and maybe return to being a more box to box as it just doesn't seem to be working out for him too well right now.
- Vic_Watson
- Posts: 8033
- Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 12:25 pm
- Location: Brazil
- Has liked: 166 likes
- Total likes: 259 likes
Re: Declan Rice
Needs to start watching videos of Bryan Robson in his pomp if he wants to be a world class all-round midfield player.