daytimedave wrote: ↑Mon Oct 03, 2022 6:13 pm
strike action i can just about handle,however........
"Services will also start later on Thursday 6 and Sunday 9 October."
whats this go slow on the following day ffs ? can some one explain ?
It's pretty simple..no night turns book on the day before (strike day) so nobody to signal etc the trains
For example last Lul strike I was nights but not my union, the drivers book on from 5am Ish .. so they came out the depots etc and we ran them empty until about 7am when we had enough stations open to run safely as they don't book on until 7am
This is a bit off-topic, but I watched a TV documentary last night about the Winter of Discontent, 1978-9. I was 10 at the time, so didn't follow the news and I wondered whether there were parallels with the current situation.
Unfortunately it was on Channel 5, so it treated the viewers like idiots and had far too many interjections from bloody Esther Rantzen and John Kettley to keep us awake.
However the impression the programme gave was that Callaghan and his Labour Government were totally incompetent, the unions were holding the country to ransom (that phrase was used several times) with ridiculous wage demands, and Thatcher was welcomed as a saviour at the General Election.
I'm an old school middle of the road liberal, but after decades of union-bashing by the Tories I have come to value their role in sticking up for workers' rights, and I wondered whether they really were such a scourge on society then, or were they just carrying out their remit.
Do any people who remember it better than me have any views?
The trains have been absolutely rammo yesterday and today. Clearly the people who normally only go in Wednesday and Thursday have gone in on Monday and Tuesday this week.
The big issue for those striking now is probably that train strikes don't really have the impact that they once had. The economy wont really suffer as most people can simply WFH those days and keep doing their jobs.
I sense the government can wait this out almost indefinitely.
Remember the mid 70's?
Yes. It was all, not surprisingly, a bit more complicated.
Basically the Heath/Barber govt. had tanked the economy 5 years previously in a mad push for growth.
Sound familiar?
southbrishammer wrote: ↑Tue Oct 04, 2022 8:10 am
However the impression the programme gave was that Callaghan and his Labour Government were totally incompetent, the unions were holding the country to ransom (that phrase was used several times) with ridiculous wage demands, and Thatcher was welcomed as a saviour at the General Election.
I'm an old school middle of the road liberal, but after decades of union-bashing by the Tories I have come to value their role in sticking up for workers' rights, and I wondered whether they really were such a scourge on society then, or were they just carrying out their remit.
Do any people who remember it better than me have any views?
I was a union member through the 70's and early 80's
There's no doubt, as I've said before, that the Unions went much too far, possibly trying to take advantage of a Labour administration while they could. This undoubtably led to the election of Mrs Thatcher, who like or loathe her, did pretty much what she said she would. She did IMO swing the pendulum too far the other way and set about ruining several industries I believe as 'punishment' to the unions. (I expect this to be challenged here but it's a debate ain't it?) I also believe that the nation is currently suffering from some of her governments most radical policies, not least of all, the privatisations of the utilities and the selling off of the council housing stock at hideous discounts, underpinning the notion that what may seem like a good short term solution is often not a good long term one
Whether that qualifies them as a scourge on 'society' I doubt, but the idea that they are 'sticking up' for workers rights is one of the unlikeliest ideas even on this thread of many colours.
Tenbury wrote: ↑Tue Oct 04, 2022 10:58 am
... and don't get totally taken in by the Thatcher myth. Were it not for the cretin Galtieri, she was gone within 2 years of taking over.
As a little aside regarding Thatcher - I took a tour of The Big Pit in Wales the week before last, and the bloke doing the tour was a former minor himself, and there was a proper hippy looking type lady in her 50's in the group that said to him after he mentioned what it was like being a miner, from the conditions to the strike, that said to him "You and many others like you must have been dancing in the streets when Thatcher died" and his reply was absolutely fantastic - which was (I can't remember it word for word) "No, because myself and other former minors are decent human beings, and we would never celebrate the death of a little old lady in her late 80's".
Not the answer Mrs Hippy lady was expecting, but I thought it was class from the old fella.
Tenbury wrote: ↑Tue Oct 04, 2022 10:58 am
... and don't get totally taken in by the Thatcher myth. Were it not for the cretin Galtieri, she was gone within 2 years of taking over.
Exactly.
She was heading for the bin - Labour under Michael Foot held a 20 points plus lead until she decided her political life hinged on sending our troops to fight for a couple of million sheep on a set of rocks in the South Atlantic.
-DL- wrote: ↑Wed Oct 05, 2022 10:23 am
As a little aside regarding Thatcher - I took a tour of The Big Pit in Wales the week before last, and the bloke doing the tour was a former minor himself, and there was a proper hippy looking type lady in her 50's in the group that said to him after he mentioned what it was like being a miner, from the conditions to the strike, that said to him "You and many others like you must have been dancing in the streets when Thatcher died" and his reply was absolutely fantastic - which was (I can't remember it word for word) "No, because myself and other former minors are decent human beings, and we would never celebrate the death of a little old lady in her late 80's".
Not the answer Mrs Hippy lady was expecting, but I thought it was class from the old fella.
He must have been the only one as there were Thatch is Dead parties at pubs and WMC's in most former pit villages.
Are you able to cite a source for that, as I'm currently on page 7 of Google, and as yet can find no reference - and seeing as for the last 30 years almost, Wales - especially South Wales and The Valleys - has in effect been my second home, as well as it being a few of my family members actual home, this is the first reference I've seen regarding there being parties in most former pit villages. In fact, the most telling things I can find are stories from places like The Independant and The Guardian about Welsh Miners paying respect to her passing, despite their deep rooted anger towards her - with it even being cited by a spokes-person from The NUM. - so perhaps Mr Former-miner-come guide wasn't being as far from the truth as you seem to think.
-DL- wrote: ↑Wed Oct 05, 2022 3:04 pm
Yes, of course he must have been, yes.
Are you able to cite a source for that, as I'm currently on page 7 of Google, and as yet can find no reference - and seeing as for the last 30 years almost, Wales - especially South Wales and The Valleys - has in effect been my second home, as well as it being a few of my family members actual home, this is the first reference I've seen regarding there being parties in most former pit villages. In fact, the most telling things I can find are stories from places like The Independant and The Guardian about Welsh Miners paying respect to her passing, despite their deep rooted anger towards her - with it even being cited by a spokes-person from The NUM. - so perhaps Mr Former-miner-come guide wasn't being as far from the truth as you seem to think.
Not in Wales but plenty in the mining villages of Yorkshire I suspect
old fart wrote: ↑Wed Oct 05, 2022 4:27 pm
Not in Wales but plenty in the mining villages of Yorkshire I suspect
Yes, from what I've read today, the celebrations seemed to be more in what was traditionally the fabled 'red wall' - but even then, there seems to be little reference to them being the norm.
I've found one or two mentions on socialist sites about a solitary party in The Valleys, but even the actual article on that was pretty ambiguous.
old fart wrote: ↑Wed Oct 05, 2022 4:27 pm
Not in Wales but plenty in the mining villages of Yorkshire I suspect
Only aware of 1 or 2 round here, there will have been a few more no doubt. One was the mock funeral that was amped up a bit for the news and was kind of mixed up with a protest about ASOS and cheap labour. The protest was planned and then thatcher died.
Lots of ex miners I know resented her but wouldn't celebrate a death, largely by then they couldn't give enough of a toss. Younger generation and the NUM women were the ones making something of it from my experience.
Hummer_I_mean_Hammer wrote: ↑Thu Oct 06, 2022 10:23 am
You're joking right..? :shock:
We banged our pans and clapped. What more could they want?
Still can't believe everyone praising themselves for that, pissed me right off. The whole nation patting themselves on the back but when I give one nurse the clap? Nothing but abuse.
