The Energy Crisis

[EvilC]

A fair point. I'm not sure we're that far apart on this. Surely, what is needed above all is clarity and fairness. If they need some people to be on prepayment meters, then everyone should be on one.

Why? They want people on prepayment meters that they perceive to be more likely not to pay them.

Prepayment is a less convenient solution for everyone. You'll also need to replace millions of meters, which just isn't practical.

[mumbles87]

Why? They want people on prepayment meters that they perceive to be more likely not to pay them.

Prepayment is a less convenient solution for everyone. You'll also need to replace millions of meters, which just isn't practical.

Would it be now with smart meters? Top ups can be done via your phone in seconds

Surely a standing order could be set up to top up aswell

The tech is there.

[EvilC]

Would it be now with smart meters? Top ups can be done via your phone in seconds

Surely a standing order could be set up to top up aswell

The tech is there.

That's a fair point - you probably need alf to opine. You'd still need to complete the SMETS 2 roll out.

And prepayment remains less convenient. So making everyone prepay seems like a bad idea to me.

[mumbles87]

That's a fair point - you probably need alf to opine. You'd still need to complete the SMETS 2 roll out.

And prepayment remains less convenient. So making everyone prepay seems like a bad idea to me.

Don't get me wrong it's a terrible idea

Just wouldnt be that inconvenient

On the subject of completing it...you can't complete it for a few reasons

1 not everyone can have one (If you live to close to an RAF base for example)
2 people are paranoid conspiracy theorists and won't get them

[chelmsfordhammer91]

I don't have a smart meter and have refused to get one.

Not for any conspiracy reasons, it's just that my current set up works fine.

I pay a monthly DD for a fixed amount, paying a fixed rate for my energy. The usual overpay in the summer to have a buffer for the winter. Usually about £100-150 up over the year but not worth reducing the DD by a tenner to potentially increase it in the future anyway.

I quite like submitting a meter reading every month or two and I know how to manage my usage to help avoid waste (my wife clearly doesn't though!).

I'd happily pre-pay if the tariff terms were the same. I'd just pay the same as the monthly DD but a few weeks earlier for the first payment.

[mumbles87]

I don't have a smart meter and have refused to get one.

Not for any conspiracy reasons, it's just that my current set up works fine.

I pay a monthly DD for a fixed amount, paying a fixed rate for my energy. The usual overpay in the summer to have a buffer for the winter. Usually about £100-150 up over the year but not worth reducing the DD by a tenner to potentially increase it in the future anyway.

I quite like submitting a meter reading every month or two and I know how to manage my usage to help avoid waste (my wife clearly doesn't though!).

I'd happily pre-pay if the tariff terms were the same. I'd just pay the same as the monthly DD but a few weeks earlier for the first payment.

You can do that with a smart metre tho and smart meters help manage our grid in the aim of moving green

Helps see when peak demand is

Why would you want to not have one?

Never plug the display in and just let it do it's work

[chelmsfordhammer91]

You can do that with a smart metre tho and smart meters help manage our grid in the aim of moving green

Helps see when peak demand is

Why would you want to not have one?

Never plug the display in and just let it do it's work

It's more a case of if it ain't broke don't fix it, rather than anything against smart meters per se.

[mumbles87]

It's more a case of if it ain't broke don't fix it, rather than anything against smart meters per se.

You mention the wife not being aware of how to save

If you get one she can see in real time what she using

[chelmsfordhammer91]

You mention the wife not being aware of how to save

If you get one she can see in real time what she using

Nah, she just isn't really bothered mate. The usual, leave the lights and TV on when leaving a room etc. It's pure habit for her and until we get to a point where we either can't afford it or it is having a material impact to our finances, it's easier to just follow her around turning it all off.

[mumbles87]

Nah, she just isn't really bothered mate. The usual, leave the lights and TV on when leaving a room etc. It's pure habit for her and until we get to a point where we either can't afford it or it is having a material impact to our finances, it's easier to just follow her around turning it all off.

I made my house as smart as I could

Alarm is linked to the lights

Alarm goes on lights go off

Alarm goes off lights come on in the areas we use all the time

Landing light linked to the landing alarm sensor. Senses movement comes on for 5 mins then goes off

Have an auto setting to turn all lights off at midnight incase we missed one

To be fair the smart lights came when next door were robbed. We can control them from anywhere and make it look like we are home

[Up the Junction]

Great reporting this. Times reporter goes undercover with a firm of debt collectors that are taking on contracts from British Gas to force entry to people's homes and fit prepay meters.

These people... debt collecters, enforcers... vermin, the absolute scum of the earth. Preying on the vulnerable, unfortunate and poverty-stricken.

How these c**** can sleep at night, I don't know.

[alf git]

That's a fair point - you probably need alf to opine. You'd still need to complete the SMETS 2 roll out.

And prepayment remains less convenient. So making everyone prepay seems like a bad idea to me.

In terms of the actual meters themselves. A Smets2 meter can be remotely switched to any tariff. Credit, pre payment, single, multi rate. The fact that the office wombles at your provider are likely to f**k it up is neither here nor there.

[alf git]

These people... debt collecters, enforcers... vermin, the absolute scum of the earth. Preying on the vulnerable, unfortunate and poverty-stricken.

How these ***** can sleep at night, I don't know.

I've never fitted for British Gas so can't comment on their working practices.

What i do know is that the majority of people pay their bills. Then there are some who are genuinely in need of help.
However there is a significant minority who won't/don't pay. They're thieves, it's as simple as that. There needs to be a sanction. They can't be allowed to get their energy for free.

I can only talk about my own experience.

By the time a warrant is issued the arrears are quite significant. Multiple thousands is the norm. I've seen as high as £10k for a single fuel.

I've never fitted a pre payment meter for anyone who is vulnerable on a warrant. The engineer has the final say regarding their risk assessment and there are many reasons why a meter exchange can be aborted.

By the same token i will happily do whatever it takes if someone is blatantly taking the p**s. The £10k gas thief was laughing when we attended as multiple engineers had knocked the job because of complex pipework. She wasn't laughing a couple of hours later.
Also for a bit of balance the debt recovery on this job was set at £20 per week because that was the maximum allowed by this particular debt recovery agency.

There are some wrong 'uns out there mind.

[Tenbury]

There are legal procedures in place for any business that is faced with unpaid debts. Why should power companies have some sort of preferential treatment? ( they don't seem all that skint really).

[Tenbury]

Why? They want people on prepayment meters that they perceive to be more likely not to pay them.

See above^^^^^^

If everyone pays for their power in the same manner, it's far more difficult to favour any one group of customers.

[EvilC]

See above^^^^^^

If everyone pays for their power in the same manner, it's far more difficult to favour any one group of customers.

The downside being it is less efficient, more expensive, needs a lot of meter replacements and those that aren’t perceived as a high credit risk get punished. I don’t see how the perceived benefit compensates for the downsides.

[Tenbury]

I'm sure we can agree to disagree

I'm still puzzled as to why the power companies should be in a priveledged position vis a vis debt recovery, though.

[EvilC]

I'm sure we can agree to disagree

I'm still puzzled as to why the power companies should be in a priveledged position vis a vis debt recovery, though.

I guess it if because it isn’t like selling them a packet of sausages. You sell someone a packet of sausages, they don’t pay you, you don’t sell them any more and go through the normal process. The utilities are basically obliged to keep selling.

[alf git]

I'm sure we can agree to disagree

I'm still puzzled as to why the power companies should be in a priveledged position vis a vis debt recovery, though.

I guess it if because it isn’t like selling them a packet of sausages. You sell someone a packet of sausages, they don’t pay you, you don’t sell them any more and go through the normal process. The utilities are basically obliged to keep selling.

A supply can only be disconnected on safety grounds. Essentially when there is a danger to life or property.
Even when a meter is removed for a tamper someone still has to fit a replacement meter.

[Tenbury]

..... and we're pretty much obliged to keep buying......