⚽West Ham Utd 2-2 Newcastle Utd (7/10/23)

Relive every moment of every first team game since the beginning of the 2005/06 season. Our archive of matchday threads originally posted in the General Discussion Forum.

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alski
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by alski »

DusseldorfHammer wrote: Mon Oct 09, 2023 12:12 pm Before Kudus getting that free hit we struggled to built any sort of attacking sequence. Couldn't get inside Newcastle's box. Completely toothless in the second half.
Free hit :smiler:
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by Bond Holder 59 »

Couldn’t sleep, so wandered off onto Toontastic forum to get a heads up on the opposition view. Well worth a look at pages 10 to 14 of their match thread. Sometimes you forget that other club’s fans can see what some of our own struggle to accept.

Summary: good away point at a strong London club, packed with talent.
🤫

Other: “only two teams have had a harder start, with better returns than us. That’s Liverpool and West Ham.”
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by WCpete »

Just rewatching Kudus's goal. You won't see many better. Beautiful first touch. There was only one place to hit it, which was through a very narrow slit and off the ground, and to have the awareness to actually see that in a nanosecond and then pull it off, that is a a different level of reflexive control than any other player in the side. We're going to see some jaw droppers from Mo.
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by SiamHammer »

WCpete wrote: Tue Oct 10, 2023 12:50 am Just rewatching Kudus's goal. You won't see many better. Beautiful first touch. There was only one place to hit it, which was through a very narrow slit and off the ground, and to have the awareness to actually see that in a nanosecond and then pull it off, that is a a different level of reflexive control than any other player in the side. We're going to see some jaw droppers from Mo.
He's a really exciting player and I can't wait to see more of him :muscle:
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by WCpete »

I didn't see Moyes go all Chico Flores on Tonali. And he's not wrong. I was surprised how easily he was outmuscled.

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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by Burnley Hammer »

Wonder if he laughs every time Paqueta goes down.
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by hammerman11 »

moyes needs to have a word with paqueta about his histrionics , also antonio does his diving swan act too often.
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by Wilko1304 »

WCpete wrote: Mon Oct 09, 2023 7:25 pm For the Aguerd haters.

Maybe direct your ire on this one toward Paqueta where it belongs. Imo.
1) criticism doesn’t make one a hater.
2) Paquetá is not to blame for that goal, nor a defender. That his effort to get back matched a centre back is worrying
3) it’s a foul
4) the above does not mean he should be saved criticism for his error. A push being given would have made it easy to forget, but wouldn’t erase that his positioning and play is poor there.
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by Crossd_Hammrs »

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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by miles »

Crossd_Hammrs wrote: Tue Oct 10, 2023 3:18 pm
The same twunt who failed to flag Isak offside from the free-kick. :angryred:
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by sendô »

REPLAY THE MATCH!

MARCH ON PARLIAMENT!

GET THE BLACK ARMBANDS OUT!
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by Sir_Trevor »

I'm pleased you posted that Crossd because I had been thinking about that incident in the light of the Geordies' 1st goal.

It's a pity it's stills rather than vid though as it seemed to be a really odd passage of play from where I was sitting albeit pretty much at the very opposite end of the stadium, although it looked like a crap decision even from there.

Iirc, as you can see from the stills, the lino did not flag immediately, but only when the ball got right to the byline. I believe that what happened in between was that the Newcastle defender got to the ball 1st and played it but then Antonio won it back from him, which was when the lino decided to put up his flag.

As it appears from the stills, that was a wrong decision anyway, but it would seem that it also applies the laws about the defender playing the ball completely differently to how they did for the Isak goal.

More inconsistency of decision making in the same game it seems! :fuming:

Also, there is clearly no way that the lino could be sure about such a hairline decision, so why on earth is he flagging there anyway?
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by Kermit »

WCpete wrote: Mon Oct 09, 2023 7:25 pm For the Aguerd haters.
What a ridiculous comment. There are many people, I am one of them, who think Aguerd has a good skillset as a footballer but is, because of certain shortcomings, not a very good central defender.

Do we hate him ? No. We simply believe his skillset could be put to better use elsewhere on the field. In any case it would be utterly ridiculous to dislike a player even if he consistently plays badly, which Aguerd does not btw. Surely it would make more sense to criticise the manager for picking a player whose performances routinely fall short of expectations.
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by Sir_Trevor »

Further on the whole offside / 1st Newcastle goal debate, I've been really mulling it over for the last few days and I think in the end that it probably was the right decision but that the law itself is badly defined with the vague word 'deliberately', which leads to it being applied inconsistently by officials.

Indeed, in just our previous game, Paqueta had a goal disallowed for an almost identical situation.

I found an interesting web page with a good discussion on it and some useful examples below:

https://www.dutchreferee.com/no-offside ... rate-play/

This 1st example really surprised me as I suspect the vast majority of us would say that this goal shouldn't have stood under the spirit of the offside rule, but, if it does, then Paqueta's against Freiburg surely should have too.



From reading this article, I feel that it is the law that is wrong as it can't be right that a player can just stand in an offside position and get an advantage when a defender is forced to try to cut the ball out but inadvertently plays it into their path as Alvarez did on Sunday.
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by MK-Hammer »

I’m still angry about the inconsistencies in the refereeing on Sunday

The lack of the ref card for 2 bookable offences
The lack of a booking when asking for a yellow card when you had already booked a player previously in the game for the same offence.
A player gaining an advantage and scoring from being in an offside position from the initial ball from the free kick

Finally the 2 handed push on the defender, unbalancing that defender, prior to scoring….not being reviewed by VAR.
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by Cuenca 'ammer »

I hate this poxy VAR with a passion. because basically that's what is being taken away from the game with all of these reviews/non reviews.

no one seems to know what the rules are. not the players, not the managers not even the bloody officials whose job it is to know the rules.

if we're stuck with this thing, which it looks like we are, then they MUST give the managers two challenges in a half. they'll be one person in the team's booth who will be on the phone to the boss on the sidelines telling him "challenge this" or "don't bother we're not going to win a challenge."

because that's the only way I see it panning out. they already do in other sports. why should football be exempt ? oh, I know, it's because the powers that run the referees have been let off the hook for so long now, it's going to take another bollock up of Liverpool proportions to end up with there being a massive overhaul.

I mean we have had several apologies this season already. there's been more scrutiny than before.
and it's going to take I hate to say it, the Big 6 (or 7 except when we're in the top 7) keep getting decisions like this. and I can even see the gambling powers complaining. I mean they stand (not that it bothers me in the slightest) a team losing, or gaining a draw, or snatching a win, from one of these decisions is going to cost the gambling industry millions. and they advertise on jerseys, pay loads in advertising revenue etc. for them not to start bitching and moaning about it.

as much as the NFL "don't like gambling" they know that millions pour into the gambling people's coffers which in turn mean more and more people tune into the games, some that might not even on paper, show much interest in, were it not for them having money riding on the game.

that's why for so long they never let a team into Vegas. now there's a hockey team and an NFL team there.
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by westham,eggyandchips »

sendô wrote: Tue Oct 10, 2023 4:27 pm REPLAY THE MATCH!

MARCH ON PARLIAMENT!

GET THE BLACK ARMBANDS OUT!
Why, what happened?
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Re: West Ham United vs Newcastle United: match thread

Post by bubbles1966 »

Finally managed to watch this game yesterday.

First half, extremely professional and disciplined - lovely goal from back to front starting with the Fonz, and the only real chance of the half for either side.

Inconsistent officiating that fell almost exclusively in Newcastle's favour was notable - the potential double yellow for Guimares, the double standards with Emerson and Almiron waving for yellows, and the incorrect offside highlighted above.

Whilst our shot count was low, there were a few 'chances to have chances' where the final ball never quite reached the intended recipient, mostly Antonio. Areola might as well have sat in the stands.

Second half, they upped the tempo but still a level game with Burn and Alvarez sharing decent chances until they scored their first from a free kick that again was given in error by the referee. They totally bossed it in the twenty minutes after that. We looked a bit fatigued, a bit indisciplined and players weren't as diligent tracking runs or as determined in challenging for the ball etc.

For all that, they have the look of a one-man team. Isak bagged two, but missing the third when Areola just managed to force him far enough away from goal showed what a wicked game it can be as they let the points slip later on.

The arrival of Kudus and Benrahma added some zip and energy, whilst Paqueta seems to do okay as a 9/false 9 later in the game when he is less required to run. Cracking strike from Kudus, whilst the otherwise peripheral Bowen almost pinched it soon after as we finished the stronger.

A fair result overall, with Isak being one of the best players we've faced, whilst the referee had one of those games where they slowly influence the outcome with numerous marginal errors.

7 points from 9 against Chelsea, Brighton and Newcastle is a very healthy return as all three will probably finish in the top half.
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