27 storey London Tower block Fire -Latimer road

[woodgreenspur]

How is this going to effect recruitment?
Can't see people wanting to go through hoops if this is how they are thought of & treated.

I saw a tweet the other day,not sure if its genuine, but it was retweeted by a fireman,and it was Doreen Lawrence pretty much retracting her previous statement.

[sendô]

Well operation "Blame the Brigade" seems to have worked, as the Grenfell residents have praised the work of the firefighters, but criticised the "top brass".

I can sympathise with the residents, as grief is a difficult thing and part of the process is finding someone immediate to blame. You have to question the reasoning here though. The fire brigade exist to put their lives at risk in order to save others, from the top to the bottom. They don't deliberately do things out of callousness, and they certainly don't earn any money from it.

The chances of any real culprits ever being held to account for this seem to be disappearing.

[The Old Man of Storr]

Far easier to blame the Fire Brigade than to make hundreds of Tower Blocks safe and now they've found their scapegoat they'll be hoping that people will forget and keep quiet about all the others - same goes for the Clutha Bar Helicopter crash , blame one man , the Pilot [ who can't defend himself ] , again far easier .

[Greatest Cockney Rip Off]

Lets hope Lammy wades into the argument with more of his sage like wisdom

Ask, and thou shalt receive ...

[Samba]

How is this going to effect recruitment?
Can't see people wanting to go through hoops if this is how they are thought of & treated.

I saw a tweet the other day,not sure if its genuine, but it was retweeted by a fireman,and it was Doreen Lawrence pretty much retracing her previous statement.

Yes, she 'apologised for any upset caused by her comments & (following meetings with the LFB & FBU) has been reassured that race played no part in the LFB's response to the Grenfell Tower fire'.

[sendô]

Rees-Mogg putting his foot in it.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-50302573

I'd wager good money that bloke has never been within 100ft of a tower block, much less been in one.

[Hammers Dad]

Rees-Mogg putting his foot in it.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-50302573

I'd wager good money that bloke has never been within 100ft of a tower block, much less been in one.

It depends on how you read his comments (or want to read his comments). He was saying that the common sense thing to do when confronted by the fire would be to leave but, given advice from the LFB to stay put, they did.
Or, he is calling all the people who died stupid and lacking common sense by staying in a burning building.
You can guess which way Corbyn took it...

By the way, if Diane Abbott had said that, Johnson would have done the same as Corbyn

[last.caress]

It depends on how you read his comments (or want to read his comments). He was saying that the common sense thing to do when confronted by the fire would be to leave but, given advice from the LFB to stay put, they did.

No he's not, he said "I think if either of us were in a fire, whatever the fire brigade said, we would leave the burning building. It just seems the common sense thing to do"

Now he's trying to pretend he really meant that he'd have stayed as per the Fire brigade's instructions at the time but now, with the benefit of hindsight, he wouldn't.

What a load of ****. Nasty ****er, knows what he said and said what he meant.

[sendô]

He knows exactly what he said and how he meant it, and he said it deliberately as part operation blame the brigade.

It's in the interest of the Tories/council/government that in people's heads the fire spreading was a "tragic accident" through some building materials not quite being up to the job, but the massive loss of life was the fault of the FB.

[James P]

I don't even think it's common sense to leave the building in that situation.

Two pieces of fire safety I've always had hammered into me is never use lifts in a fire, and it's the smoke that'll probably kill you, not the flames.

If I'm in a tower block on a higher floor and I'm made aware there's a fire a number of storeys below, I wouldn't think to take myself out of my flat and into the unknown, down who knows how many flights of stairs and try to get past the fire and smoke and out the building. I would be calling the fire brigade and if they said "stay put" I'd be thinking "Yeah, that makes sense".

[fjthegrey]

Is that before or after you'd shat your pants midst the shear panic of what was happening?

No options make sense to me when the fire has reached a certain intensity. They are climbing up the building towards you, and there will come a point where you can't out climb them. Similarly, running down towards them is not logical.

[Hammers Dad]

No he's not, he said "I think if either of us were in a fire, whatever the fire brigade said, we would leave the burning building. It just seems the common sense thing to do"

Now he's trying to pretend he really meant that he'd have stayed as per the Fire brigade's instructions at the time but now, with the benefit of hindsight, he wouldn't.

What a load of ****. Nasty ****er, knows what he said and said what he meant.

See, even I misread it.

[delbert]

The way I read it it seems like he meant what he would do in hindsight after reading the report:

Speaking on LBC's Nick Ferrari Show on Monday, Mr Rees-Mogg said: "The more one's read over the weekend about the report and about the chances of people surviving, if you just ignore what you're told and leave you are so much safer.

"And I think if either of us were in a fire, whatever the fire brigade said, we would leave the burning building. It just seems the common sense thing to do.

"And it is such a tragedy that that didn't happen."

and then:

On Tuesday, Mr Rees-Mogg said: "What I meant to say is that I would have also listened to the fire brigade's advice to stay and wait at the time.

"However, with what we know now and with hindsight I wouldn't and I don't think anyone else would. I would hate to upset the people of Grenfell if I was unclear in my comments."

If you don't like him or his politics then I suppose it's easy to misinterpret what he said:

Grime artist Stormzy has called for Mr Rees-Mogg to resign. In a series of tweets, he said it was as if Mr Rees-Mogg was saying "those who lost their lives weren't smart enough to escape".

He wrote: "Let's bare in mind for 2 secs how horrifying and terrifying the situation would of been for the victims.... and then imagine they're being instructed by fire fighters - trusted government authorities - to stay put."

In the scheme of things, plenty of people have had something to say about this tragedy, and most of them have embarrassed themselves in the process.
Phase 2 of the report will be digging into the cladding issue and looking more in depth into the cause, that one will be interesting........

[Junco Partner]

Doubt Mogg has lived in a tower block, knows anyone who lives in a tower block or has even been inside a council tower block. A lifetime of inherited privilege saw to that, so I'll take his opinions as worthless.

However It portrays a mindset that Mogg shares with many Tory's and permeates their policies...'poor people are thick, otherwise they wouldn't be poor, poverty is their fault.'

[delbert]

A Tory could run into a burning orphanage and save all the little children, you'd still moan that they didn't clean the windows on their way out..... :lol:

People see the likes of Mogg talking then switch off and hear what they want to, in all fairness I do the same with idiots I automatically disagree with as well, I imagine most of us do...........

[Danny's Dyer Acting]

A Tory could run into a burning orphanage and save all the little children, you'd still moan that they didn't clean the windows on their way out..... :lol:

People see the likes of Mogg talking then switch off and hear what they want to, in all fairness I do the same with idiots I automatically disagree with as well, I imagine most of us do...........

That's just a stupid and frankly quite offensive thing to suggest Mr. Bert.

I'd be far too busy asking him why he set the orphanage on fire in the first place.

[Danny's Dyer Acting]

"Guys, send Bridgen out to clean up the Rees-Mogg mess. He's great under pressure."

[Irrons]

Doubt Mogg has lived in a tower block, knows anyone who lives in a tower block or has even been inside a council tower block. A lifetime of inherited privilege saw to that, so I'll take his opinions as worthless.

However It portrays a mindset that Mogg shares with many Tory's and permeates their policies...'poor people are thick, otherwise they wouldn't be poor, poverty is their fault.'

The mask is slipping off, not that most people seem to notice or even care. Got to laugh at Andrew Bridgen's car crash interview afterwards. These sociopaths really don't give a f*** about anyone else but themselves and the inquiry is just a vehicle to mis-direct the blame onto firefighters whilst protecting their own from public scorn and scrutiny. Ie. the real culprits in charge of cutting safety regulations and inspections ("red tape") to increase corporate profits that were 100% the root cause for the fire which was entirely avoidable.

What gets me is that the majority of people seem to be more than happy to continue to vote for these politicians over and over again. If you choose to vote for serial liars, chancers and snake-oil salesmen then you're either a fool or a masochist

[bubbles1966]

I find myself wondering why this grotesque, Soviet style monstrosity ever got built in the first place.

For anyone who is prone or tempted to eulogise about social housing and the good old days before right to buy, this is the sort of **** heap social housing that blighted many a view and many a life for decades - a grim remnant of the fashionable, statist thinking of the 1960s.

It should have been levelled many years ago - it was hideous when I lived around the corner from it back in the early 1990s. This sorry accident should shine a spotlight on what a f*** up social housing often is. A lot of people of a particular persuasion have never lived in council housing and love to romanticise about it. The sheer shitness of it all is one of the reasons huge numbers of Londoners left London.

[The Old Man of Storr]

The way I read it it seems like he meant what he would do in hindsight after reading the report:



and then:



If you don't like him or his politics then I suppose it's easy to misinterpret what he said:



In the scheme of things, plenty of people have had something to say about this tragedy, and most of them have embarrassed themselves in the process.
Phase 2 of the report will be digging into the cladding issue and looking more in depth into the cause, that one will be interesting........

I'm with Delbert on this one , there are plenty of reasons to dislike Rees-Mogg , this ain't one of them .