Declan Rice

The Forum for all football-related discussion, including West Ham United FC. Our busiest Forum and the place to begin if you're new to KUMB.

Moderators :  chalks, Gnome, last.caress, Wilko1304, Rio, bristolhammerfc, the pink palermo

Post Reply
User avatar
sendô
Posts: 37674
Joined: Thu Nov 10, 2005 12:41 pm
Location: in the pessimistically optimistic camp.
Has liked: 272 likes
Total likes: 256 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by sendô » Thu Jan 06, 2022 4:09 pm

I know the media are desperate to generate a "transfer saga" around the narrative of him leaving in the summer, but honestly beyond someone like Man City or Real Madrid coming in with upwards of £100m and testing the resolve of Sullivan, Moyes et al I don't see it.

West Ham are still on an upwards tragectory, and Rice is the central part of that. At 22 he wont be in the position Kane was with Spurs last summer where he's desperate to win something before he retires, he's got time for that yet, so why not stay with West Ham for now and see where we go? He could well win a trophy with us or get into the CL with us yet. Imagine the sense of achievement doing that for West Ham as captain that he'd feel? It'd dwarf coming on as a sub for McTominay for Man Utd in the CL.

If we were going nowhere like Villa were when Grealish went in the summer then I'd get it, but frankly we're in a better position that Gary Neville's beloved Man Utd at the moment.

User avatar
'stone hammer
Posts: 1613
Joined: Thu Jul 24, 2008 7:28 pm
Location: Computer chair
Has liked: 17 likes
Total likes: 25 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by 'stone hammer » Thu Jan 06, 2022 4:15 pm

sendô wrote:
Thu Jan 06, 2022 4:09 pm
. Imagine the sense of achievement doing that for West Ham as captain that he'd feel? It'd dwarf coming on as a sub for McTominay for Man Utd in the CL.
Indeed, he is very much the main man, and although many of us (myself included) have twitchy sphincters about him leaving, it's probably a lot less likely than we think, assuming we continue competing for the top 6

User avatar
Estuary
Posts: 5619
Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2011 4:40 pm
Has liked: 54 likes
Total likes: 35 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by Estuary » Fri Jan 07, 2022 2:08 pm

sendô wrote:
Thu Jan 06, 2022 4:09 pm
I know the media are desperate to generate a "transfer saga" around the narrative of him leaving in the summer, but honestly beyond someone like Man City or Real Madrid coming in with upwards of £100m and testing the resolve of Sullivan, Moyes et al I don't see it.

West Ham are still on an upwards tragectory, and Rice is the central part of that. At 22 he wont be in the position Kane was with Spurs last summer where he's desperate to win something before he retires, he's got time for that yet, so why not stay with West Ham for now and see where we go? He could well win a trophy with us or get into the CL with us yet. Imagine the sense of achievement doing that for West Ham as captain that he'd feel? It'd dwarf coming on as a sub for McTominay for Man Utd in the CL.

If we were going nowhere like Villa were when Grealish went in the summer then I'd get it, but frankly we're in a better position that Gary Neville's beloved Man Utd at the moment.
Whilst I agree with the sentiment expressed here Sendo, there's no way Manchester United are qualifying for the CL in the foreseeable future. The club is broken top to bottom from years of tail wagging the dog at senior management level and they've just appointed a hard nosed marketing deal maker at CEO so the merry dance into midtable footballing purgatory is set fair for a while yet.

GetUrWangOut
Posts: 37
Joined: Tue Aug 31, 2021 11:27 pm
Has liked: 1 like
Total likes: 2 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by GetUrWangOut » Sat Jan 08, 2022 12:19 pm

I hope he stays forever but realistically City are going to be losing Fernandinho soon and Rice is a ready made replacement to compete with/ complement Rodri for the next decade.

I would wager that that’ll be where he ends up either at the end of this season or next.

Either way I’ll be enjoying having him here whilst it lasts. COYI!

User avatar
Sticky
Posts: 1491
Joined: Sat Dec 12, 2020 11:38 am
Has liked: 49 likes
Total likes: 40 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by Sticky » Sat Jan 08, 2022 2:25 pm

DM recently did an interview where he said he wants to build around Dec.

Why in the world would the 22 year old captain of a Premier League team in the quarter finals of a European competition want to leave when the project is only in it's second year - and when he is abundantly happy?

Dec will sign a new deal and be around for a while yet. The boy isn't stupid.

User avatar
sendô
Posts: 37674
Joined: Thu Nov 10, 2005 12:41 pm
Location: in the pessimistically optimistic camp.
Has liked: 272 likes
Total likes: 256 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by sendô » Sat Jan 08, 2022 2:52 pm

Estuary wrote:
Fri Jan 07, 2022 2:08 pm
Whilst I agree with the sentiment expressed here Sendo, there's no way Manchester United are qualifying for the CL in the foreseeable future. The club is broken top to bottom from years of tail wagging the dog at senior management level and they've just appointed a hard nosed marketing deal maker at CEO so the merry dance into midtable footballing purgatory is set fair for a while yet.
Yes, tbh I wasn't really suggesting they would, more making a general point that leading us out in a CL group game would be a career defining honour for him, but coming on as a sub for his CL debut for a club like Man Utd (as they are the ones "linked" to him) would not be anywhere near the same.

I think barring any more injury problems for us, it'll be us and Arsenal battling for 4th with Man Utd and Spurs fighting it out for 6th.

HammerAl
Posts: 3672
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 12:30 pm
Total likes: 75 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by HammerAl » Sat Jan 08, 2022 2:54 pm

Sticky wrote:
Sat Jan 08, 2022 2:25 pm
Why in the world would the 22 year old captain of a Premier League team in the quarter finals of a European competition want to leave when the project is only in it's second year - and when he is abundantly happy?
To treble or possibly quadruple his salary, work with better managers, coaches & players and to challenge for major honours.

User avatar
Danny's Dyer Acting
Posts: 4505
Joined: Wed Aug 19, 2009 1:37 pm
Has liked: 15 likes
Total likes: 110 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by Danny's Dyer Acting » Sat Jan 08, 2022 3:57 pm

Sticky wrote:
Sat Jan 08, 2022 2:25 pm
DM recently did an interview where he said he wants to build around Dec.

Why in the world would the 22 year old captain of a Premier League team in the quarter finals of a European competition want to leave when the project is only in it's second year - and when he is abundantly happy?

Dec will sign a new deal and be around for a while yet. The boy isn't stupid.
I can think of 200,000 reasons every week and a couple of little gold (or at least gold plated) ones every 12 months.

User avatar
Sticky
Posts: 1491
Joined: Sat Dec 12, 2020 11:38 am
Has liked: 49 likes
Total likes: 40 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by Sticky » Sat Jan 08, 2022 4:43 pm

Not everyone is motivated by money.

I'm sure Declans family are financially secure.

Regards working with 'better' players or managers. Most managers at the top clubs last 2 years - it would be extremely foolhardy for someone to gamble the rest of their career on the latest flavour of the month.

Working with better players is entirely possible at West Ham as we progress thru time.

I'm not saying he will stay with us for the rest of his life - but as long as we continue progressing - Dec can stay for another 4/5 years and if we haven't won anything he will still have plenty of time.

Whether he does or not is completely up to him - but he has no reason to leave.

HammerAl
Posts: 3672
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 12:30 pm
Total likes: 75 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by HammerAl » Sat Jan 08, 2022 4:55 pm

I’d love him to stay for 4/5 years but no chance. He’s the best central midfielder in Europe and deserves to be challenging for titles. We are pretty good but he’s outgrowing us. Look at Kane - he should have moved three years ago and has possibly missed his chance to win anything.

90% of footballers, probably more, are motivated by money and trophies are just a bonus. Very few get both money AND trophies but if Rice goes to somewhere like City then he’ll get both.

User avatar
Sticky
Posts: 1491
Joined: Sat Dec 12, 2020 11:38 am
Has liked: 49 likes
Total likes: 40 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by Sticky » Sat Jan 08, 2022 5:07 pm

Let's hope that Declan is motivated by a greater Love then...

Just to play Devils Advocate - do you not believe that Dec can win trophies here?

User avatar
Albie Beck
Posts: 7577
Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:42 am
Has liked: 35 likes
Total likes: 52 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by Albie Beck » Sat Jan 08, 2022 5:19 pm

HammerAl wrote:
Sat Jan 08, 2022 4:55 pm
Look at Kane - he should have moved three years ago and has possibly missed his chance to win anything.
Yeah but he's 92 and been badly advised. Dec's people are on the ball...

User avatar
stu1
Posts: 10159
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2009 4:57 pm
Has liked: 76 likes
Total likes: 111 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by stu1 » Sat Jan 08, 2022 5:51 pm

Sticky wrote:
Sat Jan 08, 2022 5:07 pm
Let's hope that Declan is motivated by a greater Love then...

Just to play Devils Advocate - do you not believe that Dec can win trophies here?
But as mentioned it’s not just money otherwise he might be off to Newcastle. Like it or not the top 3 can offer him ‘the full package’ involving money but also playing in the champs league, challenging for trophies every year and big trophies at that.

Does that mean I think Declan should leave this summer, no I don’t but I’m partially bias and think he could still develop here for a couple of years and maybe even lift a trophy along the way.

However we need to be realistic about what Dec will want to achieve or be interested in. That will include testing himself at the highest level of European competition each season, being managed by a Klopp or Pep and challenging for the same trophies as many of his England counterparts and best mate Mason Mount.

If he can get all that and a 200-400% pay increase then it’s not hard to see why it’s unlikely he’ll be with us in 3 years time or even 2.

User avatar
Sticky
Posts: 1491
Joined: Sat Dec 12, 2020 11:38 am
Has liked: 49 likes
Total likes: 40 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by Sticky » Sat Jan 08, 2022 6:28 pm

Na - no way.

We'll win the Europa this year and then go on dominate the CL for the next years...

I suppose it's easy for me to say with claret and blue specs on ~ but surely cementing yourself in the annals of a football clubs history and being part of their transformation is a greater pull than being another cog.

At some point - the narrative has to change, and DM has already been instrumental in changing our mentality.

I could understand if we were accepting of 10th every year and showed no ambition, but we are.

Man Utd fans probably didn't expect their fortunes to change so dramatically under Ol' Red Schnozz - and I'm sure they didn't expect their dominance to last that long.

Yeah yeah - money - but we have something special here. Players willing to run thru brick walls.

If Dec wanted to go - I wouldn't begrudge him... but I can imagine that Danny Drinkwater probably thought that he was going to become one of the best in the world when he made his move.

Dec has a good team around him, and clearly a good head on his shoulders too.

New contract please Sunshine. Dooooooo it.

Rozzop
Posts: 358
Joined: Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:31 pm
Total likes: 1 like

Re: Declan Rice

Post by Rozzop » Sun Jan 09, 2022 12:00 am

Who was the last world class player that stayed with his club and not leave for a team challenging for leagues and trophies?

I genuinely can't think of one. They all leave eventually. It would have been great for the Everton fans if Wayne Rooney had of stayed his entire career at Goodison Park and become a toffee legend. But would he have had the same trophy cabinet and goal record?

Highly doubtful.

I know we are on an upward trajectory but if someone like Harry Kane wants to leave a club who was in a champions league final not long ago than surely Declan will want to play at the very highest level too.

Im struggling to think. Does Matt Le Tissier count? Alan Shearer had already won a league title at Blackburn. Steven Gerrard might not have been winning the league title at Liverpool but he was winning everything else.

Any recent ones?

User avatar
Bubbles Fortuna
Posts: 2279
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2021 1:25 pm
Has liked: 33 likes
Total likes: 191 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by Bubbles Fortuna » Sun Jan 09, 2022 12:08 am

Steven Gerrard.

User avatar
Georgee Paris
Posts: 24714
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2004 3:07 pm
Location: The Amazing Adventures of Wicked Willy & Fearless Steve
Has liked: 51 likes
Total likes: 78 likes
Contact:

Re: Declan Rice

Post by Georgee Paris » Sun Jan 09, 2022 8:02 am

Grealish is a great example or warning of what Deccers can expect if he joins City or any other super club. 1 minute the next big thing the next just another squad number.

User avatar
Chicken Run Supreme
Posts: 12450
Joined: Fri Jul 09, 2010 8:58 am
Location: Exiled in Angus
Has liked: 74 likes
Total likes: 58 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by Chicken Run Supreme » Sun Jan 09, 2022 8:22 am

He really should be captain of England already, he does more talking on the pitch than Kane.
Hopefully he will be soon, and whilst still a WHUFC player. As long as we build on what Moyes has laid the foundations for and add some silverware along the way, he really could have it all here and would become legendary.
The best player we’ve produced since Bobby Moore and a truly world class midfielder.

User avatar
Diogenes
Posts: 2951
Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2012 5:07 pm
Has liked: 37 likes
Total likes: 83 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by Diogenes » Sun Jan 09, 2022 8:44 am

Sticky wrote:
Sat Jan 08, 2022 2:25 pm

Why in the world would the 22 year old captain of a Premier League team in the quarter finals of a European competition want to leave when the project is only in it's second year - and when he is abundantly happy?
To pretty much be guaranteed trophies and top European football every season. Anything over £75m will interest the club and £100m is a no brainer. Its then down to the lad. And why wouldn't he want to test himself with and against the very best? Everything we like about him supports that very notion. Planning for anything else is, I believe, unrealistic.

User avatar
Bubbles Fortuna
Posts: 2279
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2021 1:25 pm
Has liked: 33 likes
Total likes: 191 likes

Re: Declan Rice

Post by Bubbles Fortuna » Sun Jan 09, 2022 8:58 am

Diogenes wrote:
Sun Jan 09, 2022 8:44 am
To pretty much be guaranteed trophies and top European football every season. Anything over £75m will interest the club and £100m is a no brainer. Its then down to the lad. And why wouldn't he want to test himself with and against the very best? Everything we like about him supports that very notion. Planning for anything else is, I believe, unrealistic.
Moyes has said Rice was available for a bargain £100 million in the summer and that the bargain is gone.

Post Reply