Manuel Pellegrini: West Ham United’s 17th manager

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szola
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by szola »

btajim - mcfc wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:59 am Are we talking about the same Manuel Pellegrini here? He was a decent, honest, affable man at City who stabilised the Mancini Circus of Balotelli, Tevez etc. He could've stayed counting his money in China but he gave it up for the Premier League.
Haterz hate, Jim.

He gave us a peek at how we could play attacking football with an unbalanced squad.
We beat Chelsea at theirs.
I love him for that alone
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Iron Mark »

Backwards?

Bournemouth: 4-0 win compared to 2-2 (+2 points total)
Sheffield United: 1-0 defeat compared to 1-1 (+1)
Everton: 1-1 compared to 2-0 defeat (+2)
Leicester: 4-1 defeat compared to 2-1 defeat (against Leicester reserves) (+2)
Liverpool: 2-0 defeat, safe to assume Pellegrini would have lost as only one team have even drawn against Liverpool this season. (+2)
Brighton: 3-3 compared to 1-1 (+2)
Man City: 2-0 defeat compared to 5-0 defeat (+2)

So arguably two points better off over same fixtures earlier in the season. Five points from seven games is still a rather pathetic total, but better than three points...

How about cups?
1-0 defeat to WBA compared to 4-0 defeat to Oxford, or 4-2 defeat to AFC Wimbledon if you want last FA cup game.
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by OFT »

btajim - mcfc wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:59 am Are we talking about the same Manuel Pellegrini here? He was a decent, honest, affable man at City who stabilised the Mancini Circus of Balotelli, Tevez etc. He could've stayed counting his money in China but he gave it up for the Premier League.
With respect I don't think we are talking about the same man that was so successful at Manchester. I think we got the semi retired man who in the end just couldn't/ didn't want to deal with it. To be fair to him, his employers were crud.
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by YorksHammer »

So the one match where Moyes himself as said he had no time to change things so used Pellegrini's tactics/formation is the difference.

Otherwise we're -1 points by comparison and just losing games by less goals? And to lose by those less goals we're not even trying to win games?

Nope, not having it. 0.71 points per game in the league. Pellegrini was at 1.00 for the first 19 games of the season. 21 goals scored, 32 against - Moyes is 9 and 13 in 7 games. Extrapolate that at the same rate and we'll score 20 and concede 35 under him in the last 19 games of the season.
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Iron Mark »

YorksHammer wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 12:53 pm So the one match where Moyes himself as said he had no time to change things so used Pellegrini's tactics/formation is the difference.
So Moyes win doesn't count? I don't understand why people on this forum constantly make excuses when Moyes wins. Full blame for everything bad, but never anything to do with him if someone goes right.

Those Pellegrini tactics/formation played in a defeat to Leicester reserves. They also surrendered to a weak Palace team, making Ayew look like Messi in the process.

Most of Pellegrini's points came at the start of the season, since the Oxford game the team was in free fall. Something like 9 defeats in 12 games. In the first 8 league games Moyes will be in charge of, he would have faced the top 3 four times. A bit unfair to use a sample size like that to predict the future...

And my argument wasn't to defend Moyes, it was that Pellegrini wasn't very good either. Personally, I found his football boring to watch as well.

Ideally, we should be looking to find an improvement on both, not pining after one poor manager because the new one isn't liked.
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Hammer1972 »

Iron Mark wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 1:10 pm So Moyes win doesn't count? I don't understand why people on this forum constantly make excuses when Moyes wins. Full blame for everything bad, but never anything to do with him if someone goes right.
What exactly has gone right since he rejoined?
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Iron Mark »

Hammer1972 wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 1:13 pm What exactly has gone right since he rejoined?
Didn't say he had. Pointing out that if he gets the blame for all defeats, he should get some credit for winning as well.

It's not just this season though. Last time, he apparently only won because he got lucky with Arnie (rather than credit for moving his position and getting the best out of win) and because other teams were on their holidays (better that than to admit he got some good results...).

But this is the Pellegrini thread so I will stop there.
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Hammer1972 »

Iron Mark wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 1:22 pm Didn't say he had. Pointing out that if he gets the blame for all defeats, he should get some credit for winning as well.

It's not just this season though. Last time, he apparently only won because he got lucky with Arnie (rather than credit for moving his position and getting the best out of win) and because other teams were on their holidays (better that than to admit he got some good results...).

But this is the Pellegrini thread so I will stop there.
Trust me, if he had won last night, or even nicked a point, I would give him the credit.

But as you say, wrong thread.
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Wilko1304 »

Of those points comparison fixtures, Moyes had Everton, Bournemouth and Brighton at home. That is then a different comparison
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Iron Mark »

Do we still have "home" games?

And Pellegrini gained 1 point at home since that Oxford game. Last home win was Man United, 22nd September.
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Diogenes »

The real problem, IMO, is that a) we should never have employed Pellegrini (a Sullivan vanity project) and b) he should have been sacked some 6 to 8 weeks before (when other Chairmen were being much more decisive). In both scenarios it is unlikely we would have had Moyes, but whoever was in charge they would have had much more time to plan and sort things out.
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Ozza »

He’ll have had half a season pretty much by the time the season ends
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by lib2007 »

szola wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 12:24 pm Haterz hate, Jim.

He gave us a peek at how we could play attacking football with an unbalanced squad.
We beat Chelsea at theirs.
I love him for that alone
more like a semi hard. granted he was better than moyes, but then who isn't.
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Albie Beck »

Diogenes wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 1:44 pm The real problem, IMO, is that a) we should never have employed Pellegrini (a Sullivan vanity project) and b) he should have been sacked some 6 to 8 weeks before (when other Chairmen were being much more decisive). In both scenarios it is unlikely we would have had Moyes, but whoever was in charge they would have had much more time to plan and sort things out.
I'm not particularly anti-Moyes (although last night may start to tip things for me...) but I've posted this before on this thread and it's clear as day:

What ****ed Pellegrini up was Roberto. What we should ask is "why Roberto?". If the answer is "we had to sign a free backup keeper there was no money for anything else" then it's no wonder Roberto was chosen given he'd worked with Pell and Hus before. And that brings us full circle back to Sullivan...
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Johnny_C WHU »

Pellegrini had to go, no doubt. Looked like a man who had an agreement in place and then 'changed'.
He sold a lot in the summer and didn't replace. Not sure that was his intention but anyway he had a very light, injury prone squad.

Magic Moyes replaced him and again hasn't been given the right funding to address these problems. Don't get me wrong, think we made some good signings in Jan but it wasn't a fix.

He insisted on Roberto allegedly, and that cost him his job ultimately.


...you watch Roberto play a blinder for his new club and then go to Barcelona, its the West Ham way!!!
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Billydinho »

To sack Pellegrini and replace with Moyes is like breaking your arm and then just snapping the other one as a way of remedying it.
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Ozza »

I wonder how many of the ones who wanted Pellers out would have him back over Moyes?
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Het-Field »

Ozza wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:16 pm I wonder how many of the ones who wanted Pellers out would have him back over Moyes?
Personally, I wasn’t banging down the door for Pelly to be shown the door, but I felt change was coming and was probably needed. Even after his stay of execution after Southampton and Chelsea, he was on borrowed time.

However, I never really endorsed Moyes, simply because it represented going back a step, particularly when he was given thenlonger contract, demonstrating his brief was wider than “keep us up.” We didn’t headhunt Moyes, nor did serious research go into his appointment. He was available, out of the managerial sphere for 18 months, and had shown a willingness to go along with the transfer system in place with the club. The major problem for me was the difference in the team and squad. Getting us over the line with a better and more balanced squadwas an easier ask two years ah than it was today.
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by Depressed Hammer »

We lost to teams around us under Pellegrini. Lets not forget Newcastle hadn,t scored more than 1 away goal before they came to Olympic. 0-3 after 62 mins. Palace 1-2. Arsenal were diabolical. Masuaku shows Peppe inside twice and they score 3 goals in 10 mins. Burnley humiliated us , easy 3-0 win.
Moyes has played Everton, Leicester, City, Liverpool , Brighton at home who would have beaten us under Pellegrini judging by what previous teams around were doing there. The football is no different to Bilic, Pellegrini and Moyes. Just a different system. Moyes changed the system last time when we were clear of relegation and we played 2 cracking last games against Leicester away and Everton at home.
He isn,t my choice of manager but can anyone say they really want Pellegrini back.
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Re: Manuel Pellegrini sacked

Post by steveyrockstar »

YorksHammer wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 12:53 pm So the one match where Moyes himself as said he had no time to change things so used Pellegrini's tactics/formation is the difference.

Otherwise we're -1 points by comparison and just losing games by less goals? And to lose by those less goals we're not even trying to win games?

Nope, not having it. 0.71 points per game in the league. Pellegrini was at 1.00 for the first 19 games of the season. 21 goals scored, 32 against - Moyes is 9 and 13 in 7 games. Extrapolate that at the same rate and we'll score 20 and concede 35 under him in the last 19 games of the season.
You're both arguing over which team was very fractionally less ***** than the other. :lol:
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