West Ham Utd 3-3 Arsenal (20/03/21)

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The Old Man of Storr
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by The Old Man of Storr »

I'm surprised the Match of the Day lot didn't discuss Arsenal's second in any detail - I've watched it umpteen times and I cannot for the life of me fathom why the Referee gives Arsenal a free kick - was it for some perceived ' Dive ' by Bowen ?? Tierney is all over him , should have been a free kick to West Ham or play should have carried on if Bowen stumbled - he definitely doesn't dive , at most it's a stumble so play should have carried on BUT THEN Lacazette HANDLES the ball before kicking the ball - HUGE mistake by Moss . Was it given as a Dive then ??

Grrrr .
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Carlton Di Cottee »

Hampshire Hammer wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 11:52 am Wasn't Moss the muppet on VAR at Palace whom invented Soucek's violent elbow to prompt Dean to send him off? He has been poor for a few years and only confirmed it yesterday.
He also has a physique more akin to the refs im used to seeing in my amateur league.
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by kentishiron »

Rice and Soucek offered very little defensively yesterday, can't recall them making the tackles and interceptions that they usually do. Not a criticism of them, more so a criticism of the lack of depth in their position, as is the same up front. They looked very tired. Odegaard and Lacazette when dropping deeper had the run of the park and went virtually unchallenged every time they got the ball.
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by steveyrockstar »

Tezza65 wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 11:20 am Had time to reflect on yesterday.

We were outstanding in that first 30 minutes,no doubt about it.I thought we may get 5 before HT and should have done just that.Then we resorted to sitting back and defending.I still don't understand why we go in to this mode,but we do.

Let`s be honest,whatever their position,Arsenal have an outstanding talent of players and to me are the biggest under achievers in the PL this season,but are beginning now to tick.Their form since Christmas has been really good and they would actually be 4th on that form

The majority of that bench would probably make our first XI.That Odegaard was outstanding for them.Their squad is better than Spurs in my opinion.

So putting things into perspective, we can't really knock getting the point,though I still think the tactics cost us in the end,but our weak bench didn`t help,while Arsenal's did.
I think it's more to do with Arsenal upping about 5 gears than us sitting back.
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by TheHandOfDog »

Finished watching the game last night and it really reminded me of the Man United game at home except this time we took our chances in the first half.

So against Man United and twice against Arsenal and Spurs, we have proved that we can get at the big sides but when they decide to play or we decide to sit back, they will open us up due to their qualities combined with our current first 11s weaknesses which we all know of.

Hard to take right now but it is understandable if you take a step back and look at it properly. If we had our full strength I think we would have won this, Ogbonna is too much of a miss and Fornals does bring that relentless running energy at both ends of the pitch.

Keep winning against the so called smaller sides and top 7 should still be on the cards.
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by sendô »

The Old Man of Storr wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 11:59 am I'm surprised the Match of the Day lot didn't discuss Arsenal's second in any detail
You're surprised that Alex "I'm an Arsenal fan me just in case you didn't know, Arsenal is my team I support Arsenal, yeah, Arsenal" Scott didn't dwell on her team being gifted a generous free kick in the lead up to a goal?
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Johnny_C WHU »

Just to echo what others have said, thought we would get a draw beforehand and i am pissed off we did!
3-0 up and coasting and the Arsenal changed formation and turned the screw, we didn't know how to handle it. Think we would have benefitted from Fornals yesterday to protect the fullback. More credit to Arsenal than a West Ham collapse. Mr Moss didn't do us any favors though.

Any chance of top four died yesterday i think,
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Johnny Byrne's Boots »

The Old Man of Storr wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 11:59 am I'm surprised the Match of the Day lot didn't discuss Arsenal's second in any detail - I've watched it umpteen times and I cannot for the life of me fathom why the Referee gives Arsenal a free kick - was it for some perceived ' Dive ' by Bowen ?? Tierney is all over him , should have been a free kick to West Ham or play should have carried on if Bowen stumbled - he definitely doesn't dive , at most it's a stumble so play should have carried on BUT THEN Lacazette HANDLES the ball before kicking the ball - HUGE mistake by Moss . Was it given as a Dive then ??

Grrrr .
The only thing I can think of is that when Bowen hit the floor he grabbed the ball with his hands. As the ref didn't believe he was fouled it can only be for handball by Bowen.
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Estuary »

The Old Man of Storr wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 11:59 am I'm surprised the Match of the Day lot didn't discuss Arsenal's second in any detail - I've watched it umpteen times and I cannot for the life of me fathom why the Referee gives Arsenal a free kick - was it for some perceived ' Dive ' by Bowen ?? Tierney is all over him , should have been a free kick to West Ham or play should have carried on if Bowen stumbled - he definitely doesn't dive , at most it's a stumble so play should have carried on BUT THEN Lacazette HANDLES the ball before kicking the ball - HUGE mistake by Moss . Was it given as a Dive then ??

Grrrr .
Good spot, Bowen does "fall over" so no free kick to us, and that was his second time of trying to mug the ref, but he doesn't handle the ball or foul an Arsenal player so why did Moss give a free kick to Arsenal? It's consistent with the poor game Moss had, but he seems to have invented a foul there. The correct call would have been to wave play on.
Last edited by Estuary on Mon Mar 22, 2021 12:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by sendô »

Yeah he gave a handball against Bowen.

He'd already done the same to Coufal who was fouled by Aubamayang, booking him in the process.

Moss really did have an awful game.
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Estuary »

sendô wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 12:34 pm Yeah he gave a handball against Bowen.

He'd already done the same to Coufal who was fouled by Aubamayang, booking him in the process.

Moss really did have an awful game.
Bowen didn't touch the ball with his hand. Watch the club highlights and you'll see he doesn't.
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by ageing hammer »

Carlton Di Cottee wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 12:01 pm He also has a physique more akin to the refs im used to seeing in my amateur league.
A no rolling Moss gathers stones :)
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match threa

Post by Gsbgsb »

S-H wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 11:44 am Imagine if Payet was judged on his tracking back, and defensive displays.

You don't buy a sports car, to then take it off-roading.
I do not think you can compare Benrahma and Payet - Payet had an end product that is currently lacking from Benrahma’s game.

Pretty sure if he had the dozen or so goal contributions Payet had by this stage no one would moan, he would be the sports car you mention, but he is not, he is barely a hot hatch. When you have less goal contributions than either Fornals or Bowen the least you can do is match their work ethic.

As I said it may be adjustment issues to the rigours of the PL where talent/ability are not enough unless they are truly exceptional (as Anderson discovered) and the fact he has not had the benefit of a proper pre season with the club. Next season will be the one to judge him on but currently he does not start for me if everyone is fit.

People comment about us possible not getting Europe etc but we would already be out of it had Moyes not gone and got Lingard in January, he has shown Benrahma/Bowen the sort of level they need to reach creating/scoring wise if they want to be a top PL players.
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Dave Hedgehog »

I actually felt much better after watching that than I did after the Man Utd game. I don't mind us losing or drawing as long as we have a proper go at teams.

Like many of you have said, Moyes was hampered by a lack of depth on the bench. To be fair, there have been plenty of times this season when we have dug in and protected a lead - the law of averages says we were bound to let one slip at some point. I can't remember too many other times this season under Moyes when we have conceded a late goal to lose points. Usually it is a regular occurence with us.
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Cockneyboy311 »

It seemed to me like we didn't know what to do after going 3-0 up, and once they got a goal back we lost the momentum. That continued into the 2nd half.

Why he brought Noble on for the last 20 I don't know. No problem with Bowen going off but it should have been Fredericks or Johnson coming on to help Cresswell on the left. Everything good Arsenal did came down that side.

First thing Noble did when he came on was to give the ball back to Arsenal. I love the bloke but he's not up to it anymore. He just doesn't have the athleticism you require. He should be featuring much less in his swansong season if we want to progress.

Anyway, happy to get out of that with a point in the end. Looking forward to Oggy coming back, Dawson looks much more assured with the Italian stallion along side him than Diop.
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by westhamgardner »

Cockneyboy311 wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:09 pm It seemed to me like we didn't know what to do after going 3-0 up, and once they got a goal back we lost the momentum. That continued into the 2nd half.

Why he brought Noble on for the last 20 I don't know. No problem with Bowen going off but it should have been Fredericks or Johnson coming on to help Cresswell on the left. Everything good Arsenal did came down that side.

First thing Noble did when he came on was to give the ball back to Arsenal. I love the bloke but he's not up to it anymore. He just doesn't have the athleticism you require. He should be featuring much less in his swansong season if we want to progress.

Anyway, happy to get out of that with a point in the end. Looking forward to Oggy coming back, Dawson looks much more assured with the Italian stallion along side him than Diop.
Agree, love Nobes but trying to hang onto a lead with 20 to go he isn't the man to bring on.

Really deflating draw that felt like a defeat and I can't quite decide if it's a mental issue or a quality issue that was the problem yesterday.

It's going to be interesting to see how Moyes handles Arthur's return. We lose a bit going forward but having him on the left makes a big difference for Cresswell.
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by claretchris »

Replace Noble in this scenario with a genuine defensive midfielder who has the ability to come on and close down the space and time Arsenal were getting between our lines and we may have held on - fact is we have found 1 way of playing, when that isn't working we don't have the personnel to come on and close a game out, which makes it all the more maddening when we try to do it...
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by prophet:marginal »

Johnny Byrne's Boots wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 12:28 pm The only thing I can think of is that when Bowen hit the floor he grabbed the ball with his hands. As the ref didn't believe he was fouled it can only be for handball by Bowen.
Yep - he clearly grabbed for it having been brushed off the ball.

Even if he was fouled, he can't be doing that.
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by psychoscoredthelot »

john moss has been bitter and twisted ever since culture club disbanded
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Re: ⚽ West Ham Utd vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Diogenes »

prophet:marginal wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:51 pm Yep - he clearly grabbed for it having been brushed off the ball.

Even if he was fouled, he can't be doing that.
Well it would if he did but he didn't. Even Jamie Redknapp pointed that out during the match.
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