West Ham Utd 1-2 Arsenal (1/5/22)

Relive every moment of every first team game since the beginning of the 2005/06 season. Our archive of matchday threads originally posted in the General Discussion Forum.

Moderator: Gnome

Post Reply
User avatar
61dicksey
Posts: 15678
Joined: Sun Feb 26, 2006 10:48 am
Location: Hampshire
Has liked: 555 likes
Total likes: 401 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by 61dicksey »

Tezza65 wrote: Mon May 02, 2022 11:57 am You have to question who brought Kral and Vlassic?

Sullivan or Moyes? :chin:
The more you scrutinise it the weirder these signings are.
User avatar
MB
Cricket's Darren Anderton
Posts: 25148
Joined: Wed Dec 18, 2002 5:13 pm
Has liked: 5555 likes
Total likes: 3053 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by MB »

I think someone on here has hacked Sky. They stop short of calling for a red but...

neathiron
Posts: 5056
Joined: Sat May 19, 2007 1:25 pm
Location: Somewhere In Time on the Sea Of Madness
Has liked: 454 likes
Total likes: 316 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by neathiron »

MB wrote: Mon May 02, 2022 1:30 pm I think someone on here has hacked Sky. They stop short of calling for a red but...

I was wondering if it would be discussed on ref watch, so thanks for putting that clip up. Just a shame there'll be no retrospective action taken towards Mike Dean for his mistake.
User avatar
MB
Cricket's Darren Anderton
Posts: 25148
Joined: Wed Dec 18, 2002 5:13 pm
Has liked: 5555 likes
Total likes: 3053 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by MB »

Whether he should get sent off or not is debatable but where is VAR in all this? Given the foul the wrong way isn't a clear and obvious error?
User avatar
Collison Theory
Posts: 1824
Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:36 pm
Has liked: 18 likes
Total likes: 24 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Collison Theory »

MB wrote: Mon May 02, 2022 1:53 pm Whether he should get sent off or not is debatable but where is VAR in all this? Given the foul the wrong way isn't a clear and obvious error?
"What incidents does the VAR check?

VAR will be used only for “clear and obvious errors” or “serious missed incidents” in four match-changing situations: goals; penalty decisions; direct red-card incidents; and mistaken identity."

https://www.premierleague.com/news/1293321

So the only way VAR could get involved would have been to red card Ramsdale. By the letter of the law, they probably should have. If we accept he's trying to take Bowen out, given the speed involved, I'd say it's a red for intent to harm, but Dermot is right in that clip above- I can't think of any time a player has been red carded in a situation like this without making contact. Like most people, I was expecting a yellow for Ramsdale and was really shocked when I realised it was given the other way.

It is interesting to me that people are constantly making conspiracy theories about referees, even though players also make basic errors repeatedly and no one thinks that there's something dodgy going on there. I would consider a theory that Leicester are deliberately not defending corners this season to be just as credible, for example. I honestly can't think of a reasonable explanation as to why top professionals can't execute a simple set piece defence.
User avatar
MB
Cricket's Darren Anderton
Posts: 25148
Joined: Wed Dec 18, 2002 5:13 pm
Has liked: 5555 likes
Total likes: 3053 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by MB »

Thanks CT. I forget the remit of VAR is so limited.
User avatar
StevePottsGoalsReel
Posts: 5864
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2016 9:05 am
Has liked: 3122 likes
Total likes: 2265 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by StevePottsGoalsReel »

Collison Theory wrote: Mon May 02, 2022 2:08 pm It is interesting to me that people are constantly making conspiracy theories about referees, even though players also make basic errors repeatedly and no one thinks that there's something dodgy going on there. I would consider a theory that Leicester are deliberately not defending corners this season to be just as credible, for example. I honestly can't think of a reasonable explanation as to why top professionals can't execute a simple set piece defence.
That's actually quite a good comparison though.

I don't think there's any grand conspiracy theory, but I do think mediocre English referees (i.e. all of them) consistently bottle it in a way that favours the established big clubs just as mediocre players fail at their jobs in ways that favour the established big clubs.
User avatar
jastons
Posts: 12533
Joined: Fri May 07, 2004 7:23 am
Location: Here
Has liked: 885 likes
Total likes: 837 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by jastons »

Collison Theory wrote: Mon May 02, 2022 2:08 pm "What incidents does the VAR check?

VAR will be used only for “clear and obvious errors” or “serious missed incidents” in four match-changing situations: goals; penalty decisions; direct red-card incidents; and mistaken identity."
Mistaken identity - Mike Dean gave Bowen a yellow card instead of Ramsdale
User avatar
Oldun
Posts: 8135
Joined: Mon Apr 11, 2005 9:59 am
Location: living in the past and loving it.
Has liked: 165 likes
Total likes: 566 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Oldun »

User avatar
Samba
Posts: 21811
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 3:36 pm
Location: David Sullivan's least favourite fluffer.
Has liked: 2484 likes
Total likes: 895 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Samba »

Tenbury wrote: Mon May 02, 2022 6:12 am Even if we go all the way in the EL ( :pray:), I honestly think I'm done with PL football.
Couple of years ago I'd have ridiculed the conspiracy theorists... more fool me.
I feel the same, Tenners. I think many do.
Used to love watching motd & motd2, still record every one but apart from our bit, I just delete them without watching the rest.
El brooko79
Posts: 9427
Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2019 10:38 am
Has liked: 2962 likes
Total likes: 1975 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by El brooko79 »

Collison Theory wrote: Mon May 02, 2022 2:08 pm "What incidents does the VAR check?

It is interesting to me that people are constantly making conspiracy theories about referees, even though players also make basic errors repeatedly and no one thinks that there's something dodgy going on there.
There is no conscious conspiracy imo.

What there is a blantent bias to not give decisions against the so called power houses because they find it far easier upset the small fish.

It's lazy and cowardly but refs/VAR sleep quite happily knowing they have f*cked over the plebs rather than face the wrath of the super six. Any slight doubt if goes their way.

If thar had been Salah yesterday it would be all over the media. MOTD didn't even discuss it I don't think.
User avatar
Samba
Posts: 21811
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 3:36 pm
Location: David Sullivan's least favourite fluffer.
Has liked: 2484 likes
Total likes: 895 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Samba »

Dreadful, reckless challenge by Ramsdale, imo & no way that Bowen 'dived' just for the sake of it. He's an honest lad from everything that I've seen of him.
Same as Lanzini, a few seasons ago. Just come back from a terrible ACL injury & got carded for 'diving' rather than someone understanding that he just might have been trying to protect himself.
User avatar
Colours never run
Posts: 25386
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 1:46 am
Location: "Be in no doubt, we are part of the most successful stadium migration in history"
Has liked: 6811 likes
Total likes: 2363 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Colours never run »

Cheating ****ers never change. Them and Liverpool are the worst teams to cheat, dive and time waste. A running joke that's been going on for donkey's. What's Judy as bad is the Officials usually turn a blind eye to these Clubs antics too, time and time again. :asleep:
Online
User avatar
HammerMan2004
Posts: 26784
Joined: Thu Mar 18, 2004 10:01 pm
Location: I have no idea.
Has liked: 498 likes
Total likes: 1275 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by HammerMan2004 »

Astounding decision to book Bowen by a disaster of a referee, who I can’t wait to see retire.

In another world the ref shows a red, VAR intervene, it gets downgraded to a yellow because he’s going away from goal and there’s no contact, we get the free kick and just get on with the game.

Ramsdale has charged in to clear the ball, Bowen got there first. It’s about as blatant a foul as you can get without touching someone.
User avatar
dave_l
Posts: 2825
Joined: Mon May 31, 2004 2:38 pm
Location: Bromley
Has liked: 79 likes
Total likes: 51 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by dave_l »

It was just one of those games on Sunday where I expected nothing from it, but actually we looked in touch all game and ended up frustrated that we lost. Both goals probably don't happen if Dawson is on the pitch. That a backline with Fredericks as a sort of left back and Cress at CB conceded only 2 is nothing short of remarkable. (I was having Lomas, Dailly, Breen Minto nightmares before kick off). Plenty has been said about the Ramsdale incident, I still can't quite work out how the ref has decided that Bowen's at fault until I remember that Mike Dean was the ref. You can't just come flying out studs up like that, Ramsdale's a lucky barsteward.

Behing relatively close to behind the Arsenal dugout - Arteta doing what looked like the YMCA for half the match was an absolutely bizarre sight. I don't think any of the players were watching, let alone interpreting his actions which made him look a cross between a constipated owl and a geezer doing semaphore on fast forward. Still if it makes him feel better... He really comes across as a snide little so and so too which doesn't help. I really wish the old rules were in place so that if we win the Europa we'd boot them out of the Chumps league if they finished 4th.

Surely the lesson to be learnt from this season is squad depth, squad depth and more squad depth. In general I'm pleased we're still vaguely in the hunt for 6th at this stage. Plenty of teams have qualified for the Europa league and it's absolutely stuffed their season - they've ended up in the lower reaches and flirted with relegation. The fact we're still in this hunt for 6th despite our small squad and short turnarounds is testament to how well a lot of our players have done, plus Moyes and his team of course. I hope over the summer that this will be addressed - we've had 2 seasons where we've done very well with the players we've got but marginal improvements would've seen us well in the challenge for 4th. So come on GSB-K - lets make those signings.
User avatar
Estuary
Posts: 6021
Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2011 4:40 pm
Has liked: 275 likes
Total likes: 116 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Estuary »

When, like us, you've had players red carded when the actually got the ball before contact but are deemed "out of control" the ref's reaction to Ramsdale is hard to take. But to book Bowen for trying to avoid injury shows how out of touch with what goes on refs are.

I bet a certain someone is spinning.
Online
User avatar
Billy Hunt
Posts: 3207
Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2005 10:05 pm
Has liked: 468 likes
Total likes: 352 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by Billy Hunt »

neathiron wrote: Mon May 02, 2022 1:47 pm I was wondering if it would be discussed on ref watch, so thanks for putting that clip up. Just a shame there'll be no retrospective action taken towards Mike Dean for his mistake.
The worrying thing here is Mike Dean will be actively involved with VAR next season...

I do not think there could be any complaints if the keeper was shown a red. Reckless, intent, studs up and was within a fraction of connecting with Bowens lower leg, but for Bowen taking avoiding action. And Bowen got booked for that ?

It all happened fairly near where we sit, so I had a great view of it real time, and was surprised to see just a yellow, but disgusted to see it was for Bowen not the keeper. Mike Dean strikes again, what a prick.

So on the basis there was no contact, if you swing a couple of punches at someone on the pitch, they avoid the punches, there is no punishment levelled at the aggressor ?
User avatar
smuts
Posts: 33747
Joined: Sun Jan 28, 2007 9:28 am
Location: East, East, East London
Has liked: 1498 likes
Total likes: 1440 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by smuts »

You'd like to think the PL would at least chalk the yellow off...but they can't make their soon to retire celebrity ref look even more daft can they?

I bet Dean will be eating sheep's b*llocks on I'm a Celeb within 2 years. :thdn:
User avatar
S-H
Posts: 49113
Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2010 7:05 am
Location: Kumb Inn
Has liked: 5738 likes
Total likes: 9649 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by S-H »

smuts wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 9:42 am
I bet Dean will be eating sheep's b*llocks on I'm a Celeb within 2 years. :thdn:
I hope the c*nt chokes!
unmartillo
Posts: 666
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2012 1:10 pm
Total likes: 76 likes

Re: ⚽ West Ham United vs Arsenal: match thread

Post by unmartillo »

I didn't even realise the yellow card was for Bowen, just assumed it was for Ramsdale. I've never been as baffled by a decision. Madness.
Post Reply