The Rings of Power TV Series (LoTR Universe)

[Ironing Board]

Maybe I'm not making my point very well. Tolkien built his world with great care and included 'people of colour' such as the Southrons who were dark skinned humans. As such it would be logical that there may be the equivalent darker skinned members of other races and that seems entirely appropriate. I would expect to see them in busy metropolis' of the pseudo north European medieval setting that Eriador reflects but it's far less plausible to see them in isolationist societies such as the Harfoots.

Exactly. When you have clannish/prehistorical societies it takes away suspension of disbelief when you infuse modern multicultural casting. The same disbelief is shattered when they do it with historical dramas.

[Mayday]

Maybe I'm not making my point very well. Tolkien built his world with great care and included 'people of colour' such as the Southrons who were dark skinned humans. As such it would be logical that there may be the equivalent darker skinned members of other races and that seems entirely appropriate. I would expect to see them in busy metropolis' of the pseudo north European medieval setting that Eriador reflects but it's far less plausible to see them in isolationist societies such as the Harfoots.

That's the point though. It's not plausible, none of it is. It's a completely made up fantasy world, even more so now its beyond 'Tolkein's vision'. So the fact there are 'different colours' wherever they may be, shouldn't matter at all.

If people would let all this 'stuff' go, I'm sure you would enjoy it more instead of always going "but, but, but, but.. ".
I made a little joke to my son about the opening scene when Galadriels brother was explaining how a ship floats (sunlight and other such mystical nonsense). I turned to my son and said " I think you'll find its the 'Archimedes principle'" Guffaw, guffaw. Its a similar analogy that really doesn't matter when delving into the realms of fantasy.

[Metal Hammer]

That's the point though. It's not plausible, none of it is. It's a completely made up fantasy world, even more so now its beyond 'Tolkein's vision'. So the fact there are 'different colours' wherever they may be, shouldn't matter at all.

I've seen similar arguments peddled elsewhere that you should accept it because you are happy to accept the existence of Elves etc you should be happy to accept shoddy treatment of fantasy world building.

[Mayday]

I've seen similar arguments peddled elsewhere that you should accept it because you are happy to accept the existence of Elves etc you should be happy to accept shoddy treatment of fantasy world building.

Well yes you should because otherwise these fantasy worlds will exist in reality, which they don't.
Physics do not exist in these worlds, let alone anything else.

[Metal Hammer]

Well yes you should because otherwise these fantasy worlds will exist in reality, which they don't.
Physics do not exist in these worlds, let alone anything else.

Well I'm viewing things as an old school fantasy geek who grew up reading **** loads of fantasy and sci-fi (I'm in my mid 50s now) and spent over 15 years GMing various pen and paper RPGs. A strong fantasy setting in such scenarios needs to be accepted by readers/players - remember this is escapism, not a journey into the contemporary real world.

Who wasn’t mesmerized by the fantasies of elves and hobbits, wizards and warlocks, vampires and werewolves, superheroes and villains, or fairies and monsters of mythical proportions? We all remember these stories from our youth because fantasy is immersive, gripping, and capable of imparting lifelong moral truths.

To me this immersion starts to degrade when we start to impose modern societal values in an attempt to make something more appealing to contemporary values in some tick box exercise.

[Mayday]

Well I'm viewing things as an old school fantasy geek who grew up reading **** loads of fantasy and sci-fi (I'm in my mid 50s now) and spent over 15 years GMing various pen and paper RPGs. A strong fantasy setting in such scenarios needs to be accepted by readers/players - remember this is escapism, not a journey into the contemporary real world.

this is me.
D&D, AD&D, WFRP, Runequest, Shadowrun, Judge Dredd, Battletech, James Bond, TMNT, etc. etc.

The Raymond E Feist and Michael Morcock were always my favourite books. Especially Feist.

[WCpete]

All the main and controversial talking points aside, and tbf those are the points that will determine whether this thing sinks or swims, I think the writing and particularly the dialogue is poor. The actors are ok, but only ok, although Durin and Nory have been good imo. There is minimal to no character development. The storyline has developed marginally, but only because the show makers have counted on the viewer to have some knowledge of Tolkien's other works eg, who the baddie is, what he's going to do, who the main protagonists are. Without having at least seen the Jackson films, the characters and story are paper thin. Because of that the impending "all is not well" storyline has no urgency or heft. It's dull, and none of it make me care about any of it. But it is gorgeous. I will give it that.

[Metal Hammer]

this is me.
D&D, AD&D, WFRP, Runequest, Shadowrun, Judge Dredd, Battletech, James Bond, TMNT, etc. etc.

The Raymond E Feist and Michael Morcock were always my favourite books. Especially Feist.

Yes, Elric was a fantastic character. I'd add authors such as Gene Wolfe, AA Attanasio, and David Gemmell to the list. In fact, all of those have created works that would make amazing TV series or films.

[Cuenca 'ammer]

having just watched the first 2 episodes, I kind of feel the same as with The House of Dragons.

if we hadn't had the success of The Lord of The Rings and to some extent The Hobbit, and/or Game of Thrones, would they have made either of these ?

my answer is probably not really.

they seem to be flying on the coat tails of their predecessors and couldn't stand on their own being made without the other "success" stories. are they strong enough to do so ?

I'm kind of with Pete here, the film making is very good, effects etc. etc. and maybe the dialogue and story lines will get stronger as we go along.

would I watch either, if it was created first and stick with it ? er, maybe not.

the real test to me will eventually, would I re-watch either series over and over as I have done with Lord of the Rings and The Hobbit and GoT. probably not.

this feels a bit like Predator thing they just released. the prequel.

it was decent I give you that. not sure how many times I've watched the original but will I watch the new one again ? nah. and I kind of feel the same with this.

problem is I had read both books (well the entire series) many times of Tolkien's works and GoT probably 3 times. so I did have the written material as a "comparison" whereas I haven't put together any of the Tolkien stuff, gave up on The Simirillion and of course they're NEVER going to finish GoT so this is a new idea floated to me.

50 hours is a lot of investment, although to be fair, I've probably done more with other series, Breaking Bad, Bosch, The Last Kingdom, etc. etc. so perhaps this will take me to the end, if I am still on This Mortal Coil.



so far, both TRoP and THoD is an................ okay......

[Mayday]

Yes, Elric was a fantastic character. I'd add authors such as Gene Wolfe, AA Attanasio, and David Gemmell to the list. In fact, all of those have created works that would make amazing TV series or films.

Yep, love a bit of Gemmell (difficult to chose a favourite set of books/hero). Eddings was good too (up to a point) and I love a bit of Stephen Lawhead for his take on the Arthurian legends

[Metal Hammer]

this is me.
D&D, AD&D, WFRP, Runequest, Shadowrun, Judge Dredd, Battletech, James Bond, TMNT, etc. etc.

The Raymond E Feist and Michael Morcock were always my favourite books. Especially Feist.

I GM'd D&D, AD&D, Gamma World, WFRP, Cyberpunk, Paranoia, Traveller, Legend Of The 5 Rings, Dangerous Journeys, Call of Cthulhu, and Vampire the Masquerade to name a few! Good times

[WCpete]

"Do you know why a ship floats and a stone cannot?"

Uhm, displacement, buoyancy, density, Archimedean principles etc? Nope. Because ships look upward, and stones look downward.

That was the writers trying to sound like Tolkien. Please stop doing that.

[Mayday]

I GM'd D&D, AD&D, Gamma World, WFRP, Cyberpunk, Paranoia, Traveller, Legend Of The 5 Rings, Dangerous Journeys, Call of Cthulhu, and Vampire the Masquerade to name a few! Good times

Ahh Cyberpunk, I forgot that one. It was great.
Bizarrely I have never, ever played CoC, much to my dismay. Even though that sort of thing is right up my street and have read the novels etc.

There used to be a solid core of six of us who played, sometimes even more, from another circle of friends so it could go up to 10 even. WFRP was my main GM'ing bag and sometimes others. We all used to take various turns and each would have thier own GM'ing niche.
I still have fond memories of several characters and thier exploits.

[Cuenca 'ammer]

surprised that the Harfoots (equivalent of Travelers, no ?) have Irish accents ? isn't that being a bit stereotypical ?

why do all dwarfs have Scottish accents ? and all of the elves have English accents ? couldn't some of them come from elsewhere ?

just picking holes.

[WCpete]

3 episodes in now. Its biggest problem is its main character. It's not an issue of backlash against 'wokeness' or abandonment of Tolkien canon. Galadriel is portrayed as an obnoxious, confrontational, very unpleasant and petulant teenager who is completely bereft of grace. The writing for this character is terrible. And she's probably been miscast as well, if I'm being honest. For all this show's problems, they'd ultimately get away with all of it were it not for Galadriel. I'm kind of rooting for the baddies at this point.

[vietnammer]

surprised that the Harfoots (equivalent of Travelers, no ?) have Irish accents ? isn't that being a bit stereotypical ?

why do all dwarfs have Scottish accents ? and all of the elves have English accents ? couldn't some of them come from elsewhere ?

just picking holes.

I guess it's about giving audiences something to recognise, but which audiences? And don't the Orcs sound like Cockney prison screws from other films?

[Cuenca 'ammer]

3 episodes in and this show is going nowhere in a hurry.

in fact after dinner I was watching this, and went to wash the dishes while it was still playing that's how riveting it is to me at least.

[wolf359]

3 episodes in and this show is going nowhere in a hurry.

in fact after dinner I was watching this, and went to wash the dishes while it was still playing that's how riveting it is to me at least.

It is 4 in (not sure if that was a slip or you are one behind) which shows just how little we care. Episode 4 was an improvement but it is still just good looking meh and some of the acting is bloody terrible (Elrond and the stroppy Galadriel the worst culprits.) The stuff with the Black elf (I don't even know his name!) and the humans is the best, thought the scene with the boy escaping reminding me of playing a computer game, avoiding patrols and rolling in and out of shadows (Thief for back in the day; maybe)

[Metal Hammer]

My missus didn't warm to this and was bored stiff after the first 2 so I haven't watched any more yet, it will have to be when she's gone to bed I guess!

[Cuenca 'ammer]

It is 4 in (not sure if that was a slip or you are one behind) which shows just how little we care. Episode 4 was an improvement but it is still just good looking meh and some of the acting is bloody terrible (Elrond and the stroppy Galadriel the worst culprits.) The stuff with the Black elf (I don't even know his name!) and the humans is the best, thought the scene with the boy escaping reminding me of playing a computer game, avoiding patrols and rolling in and out of shadows (Thief for back in the day; maybe)

no mate, I am one behind. had a bit going on the past week, (brilliant for once) and am just managing to catch up.

already I am so over the bloke who fell from the sky. they could chuck that bit out and I wouldn't miss it one jot. he's going to have to be a VERY important part of the story for us to go this long building up his "character" (which is almost an oxymoron) with the travelers.

I think that committing to 5 seasons means that they're going to have to stretch out many story lines to make it last that long. that bit for example with Galadriel and the bloke on the boat and her meeting the others, and the sea worm ? could have been done in about 10 minutes tops.

there's several story lines I feel like that about. instead of seeing how things go, they're stuck with 50 hours of story telling. whereas GoT's finish was hurried, this thing seems to be going the complete opposite way. at least with TLotR and The Hobbit there was a start point and finish point and of course The Hobbit could have been done in one film, two an absolute stretch. no way it goes 3 films. for a book that was less that one third of TLofR to come up with the same about 9 hours of filming was way over the top.

this series had better be the best thing EVER on tv to quantify spending that amount of dosh on it.

feels like Bezos said, here's half a billion dollars to spend, we're committed to 5 seasons how you go about filling the time in, is completely up to you. give me brilliant scenery and quality CGG and I don't really care about the rest.