jastons wrote: ↑Thu Apr 27, 2023 6:03 pm
A union looks after the interest of its members.
It's not in the members interests to run the industry to the wall or push customers (sorry the public they gallantly serve) towards alternative transport. Damaging the business you work for is damaging yourself at some stage surely.
At some point if there is to be negotiation all sides need to lose a bit of face. I'm not sure there will be tbh, I think it might be quite convenient to have a pantomime villain strike going around the election build up.
SammyLeeWasOffside wrote: ↑Thu Apr 27, 2023 6:20 pm
It's not in the members interests to run the industry to the wall or push customers (sorry the public they gallantly serve) towards alternative transport. Damaging the business you work for is damaging yourself at some stage surely.
Are the strikers doing that ?
Thew logic of those on strike is they are seeing their living standards being eroded, while their employer pleads poverty, saying they cannot afford to pay more.
Meanwhile shareholders are being paid millions in dividends.
The railways were sold off for ideological reasons not economic ones.
the pink palermo wrote: ↑Thu Apr 27, 2023 7:40 pm
Are the strikers doing that ?
Thew logic of those on strike is they are seeing their living standards being eroded, while their employer pleads poverty, saying they cannot afford to pay more.
Meanwhile shareholders are being paid millions in dividends.
The railways were sold off for ideological reasons not economic ones.
Not deliberately but if you give people the chance to try alternatives they might not come back. We've used the bus to get to the smoke this year and will stick with it. Cheaper, cleaner, more reliable, better facilities.
Like it or not it's in the rail unions interest for there to be rail.
It may well have been ideology but it was also a **** service by the late 70s
SammyLeeWasOffside wrote: ↑Thu Apr 27, 2023 8:22 pm
Not deliberately but if you give people the chance to try alternatives they might not come back. We've used the bus to get to the smoke this year and will stick with it. Cheaper, cleaner, more reliable, better facilities.
Like it or not it's in the rail unions interest for there to be rail.
It may well have been ideology but it was also a **** service by the late 70s
Surely the obscene prices the train companies are charging would lead people to other forms of transport by now if it was that simple
Was it not a **** service by then due to them
systematically under serving it to the point where public opinion would allow them to sell it off without much backlash? A bit like them slowly running the NHS into the ground for the same goal
SammyLeeWasOffside wrote: ↑Thu Apr 27, 2023 6:20 pm
It's not in the members interests to run the industry to the wall or push customers (sorry the public they gallantly serve) towards alternative transport. Damaging the business you work for is damaging yourself at some stage surely.
At some point if there is to be negotiation all sides need to lose a bit of face.
Unlike the nurses, where if you need then you need them, people can and will make alternatives to the train. It's why I agree with the second point so much.
D C wrote: ↑Thu Apr 27, 2023 11:38 pm
Surely the obscene prices the train companies are charging would lead people to other forms of transport by now if it was that simple
Was it not a **** service by then due to them
systematically under serving it to the point where public opinion would allow them to sell it off without much backlash? A bit like them slowly running the NHS into the ground for the same goal
Maybe routine plays a part for lots of people. It's easier to pay up and keep doing what they have. If the service isn't actually available they are forced to find alternatives and find.they prefer that.
Unless they were planning on a sell off right through the 70s then no. The service was terrible for some time, long enough to become a national joke.
Running it down how? By pouring more money than at any time in history into it you mean?
daytimedave wrote: ↑Fri Apr 28, 2023 12:57 pm
my heart bleeds for those poor railway workers
You do have to question their thinking behind this. Surely, you'd get less kickback from the public if it was on a normal Monday or Friday, sure some people would lose a day’s money, but to complicate the FA cup final travel is a ludicrous policy in terms of hearts & minds, on par with gluing yourself to trains and roads during the working week.
Not every rail worker. The fella who sits next to me at the LS works for SWT and he said the strikes are really starting to bite him financially and he's really ****ed off about it. I asked whether the union can help in any way and he says to qualify he would have to provide bank statements, utility bills and even have an interview, for what would be perhaps 50 quid a week.
The frustrating thing is something like 6% and no changes to conditions would probably clinch it despite food inflation being at least 15%. Which is still a real time pay cut.
What some don't get is it doesn't matter what your original wage is, if it gets chipped away every year we will all end up on minimum wage.
Strikers are not trying to get richer, just be less worse off.
Train companies and government do a deal. They will accept far less than their bargaining position.
bonzosbeard wrote: ↑Fri Apr 28, 2023 2:17 pm
The frustrating thing is something like 6% and no changes to conditions would probably clinch it despite food inflation being at least 15%. Which is still a real time pay cut.
Well, that depends on whether the only thing you ever spend your money on is food, which must be close to no one.
RichieRiv wrote: ↑Fri Apr 28, 2023 2:12 pm
Not every rail worker.
My thoughts were really about the union leadership and those who timetabled the dates for strike action. Can't imagine anyone wanting to lose a days money due to having to strike.
Funny enough it always seems like shop stewards (in my limited opinion) and union leaders (always seem to have nice digs whenever pictured leaving home) end up being ok regardless of what happens.
